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PostPosted: 21 Oct 2007 21:15 
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BARGALA

It is located near Štip, on the coast of the river Bregalnica. The last archeological researches, discovers that the period of late antique and the early Christian period was fill out with plenty monuments. The late Roman period was in a good mood in the place of Bargala and the region of the river Kozjak. In the 4th and 5th century AD, Bargala became important and well known strong cultural and churchly center.

The city was spread on 5 hectares of land. It was protected by a walls with height of 2,2 meters. The Christian complex is contained by a 4 basilicas, 3 big and 1 small. And also there was e residence for the episcope. The city was in the part of the province middle Dachiya. In the literature is first mentioned in the year of 451 AD, in the list of the meeting of Halkedon, where the episcope Dardanius from Bargala is written right near the episcope Nikola from Stobi. The both of them were mentioned in the group of episcopes of Macedonia. Not far from Bargala was discovered the ruins of the ancient city of Astibo, near Štip.
In Macedonia were discovered around 130 basilicas in: mostly in the archeological sites, in villages and in rural places.

http://makedonija.name/culture.php?page=bargala


and here´s a NewsFlash

Basilica_excavated_in - BARGALA (MACEDONIA - STIP)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w3zsUMARvHk

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12/21/2012 @11:11p.m. , what will happen ?

--------------------------------------------------------
1) Macedonians belong to the "older" Mediterranean substratum...
2) Macedonians are not related with geographically close Greeks, who do not belong to the "older" Mediterranenan substratum...


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PostPosted: 22 Oct 2007 08:46 
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Thanks dimko!


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PostPosted: 10 Nov 2007 18:24 
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Потрага по главниот град на Пајонијакири против инкасаторите

Поминал ли Александар Македонски со својата војска низ Дреновската Клисура, на локалитетот Градиште, каде што веќе се ископани масивни мермерни блокови и се претпоставува дека земјата крие ранохристијанска базилика и средновековна црква? Што е ископано и изнесено преку отворените сонди со кратер од околу три метри во длабочина?
Археолозите ја започнаа потрагата по одговорите на овие и на многу други прашања, кои, велат, ќе отворат нова страница во светската историја и ќе го стават локалитетот Градиште меѓу десетте топ-локалитети во Македонија. Досега, велат археолозите, локалитетот неправедно е запоставен и оставен на милост и на немилост на дивите копачи. Со дозвола од Управата за заштита на културното наследство и со скромни 45.000 денари, екипи од Музеј-галеријата од Кавадарци, од Катедрата за археологија на Филозофскиот факултет, Институтот за историја на уметност и археологија и средношколци од кавадаречката гимназија десетина дена работеа три километри северозападно од селото Дреново, на самиот магистрален пат Градско-Прилеп, каде што се вршеле ископувања уште во далечната 1932 година, но од 2003 година локалитетот е предмет на систематски истражувања. Работено е на два сектора и притоа се откриени остатоци од некропола и петнаесетина површински гробни прилози во кои се чувани мирисливи масла, како и масивни мермерни блокови за кои се претпоставува дека се врата од некој храм. Комплетниот керамички материјал, заедно со десетината монети од средниот век кои се откриени на длабочина од шеесетина сантиметри, укажуваат на тоа дека се што е пронајдено е од доцниот римски период.
"Она што го бараме ние е кралството на Пајонците, а тоа е многу порано, во четвртиот век пред нашата ера, уште во класичното време, кога Пајонското Кралство владеело на овие простори, а главниот град Еутарист бил најзначајниот центар", вели раководителот на проектот Весна Ѓорѓиева, виш кустос во Музеј-галеријата во Кавадарци. Според картата на Интергијана, самиот град е со површина од 17 хектари и се претпоставува дека бил лоциран токму тука, во Дреновската Котлина пресечена со природни карпи. Професорот д-р Виктор Лилчиќ, како кораководител на проектот, ја поткрепува ваквата претпоставка со фактот дека токму тука, на северозападната падина на Градиштето Дреново е пронајдено најголемото депо од триесетина монети на последниот крал на Пајонците, Дропион, што упатува на претпоставката дека, можеби, во овој град се наоѓала и главната ковачница за монети.
"Ако разговарате со луѓе од Нумизматичкото друштво во Скопје, ќе ви кажат дека досега дивите копачи изнеле над 300.000 монети од утробата на оваа земја", вели професорот Лилчиќ. "За несреќа, горните површини, акрополата, тие се веќе исчистени, таму веќе не можат да се пронајдат метални предмети или монети, но во подножјата на јужната и на западната страна, на терасите, со подоцнежните ископувања можат да се најдат уште многу парчиња, што дава надеж дека објектот не е убиен. За овие десетина дена од нашите истражувања ние најдовме еден сребрен денар на римскиот цар Трајан и неколку бронзени монети од вториот век пред новата ера на градовите Пела, Тесалоники и Стоби, како и на некои македонски кралеви", вели професорот Лилчиќ.
Музејот на град Кавадарци веќе го изготви проектот за продолжување на работите на овој локалитет во наредната година, со кој побара од Министерството за култура да му бидат одобрени околу 300.000 денари.
"За ваков значаен археолошки локалитет се потребни многу повеќе пари, па очекуваме дека и локалната самоуправа ќе се вклучи со финансиски средства, кои би овозможиле работите да се реализираат во еден подолг временски континуитет", вели Петре Камчевски, кустос-советник и директор на Музејот во Кавадарци.
Според археолозите, предвидено е напролет да се направат геоскенирања на теренот на површина од десетина хектари за да може да се отвори бедемот на градот и да се откопа и да се конзервира некој објект што ќе биде отворен за јавноста. Тоа е првата фаза од работите, кои ќе траат минимум три години. Во втората фаза ќе треба да се изгради пристап до археолошкиот локалитет, паркинг-простор и музејска збирка, а паралелно ќе треба да се работи на негово промовирање во јавноста за да можат туристичките агенции да го стават во своите понуди како значајна археолошка локација. За да се почне константно да се работи, годишно ќе бидат потребни средства во висина од пет милиони денари, но во оваа сума не влегуваат конзерваторските работи, оградувањето на просторот и чуварската служба.
"Овој локалитет во Градиште се наоѓа на главната магистрала, и затоа се издвојува како локалитет од прва категорија најпогоден за афирмација на македонската култура", тврди Лилчиќ.
Археолозите се надеваат дека ќе го откријат одговорот во истражувањата зошто згаснал градот Еударист, кој имал континуитет од железното време до средниот век и очекуваат дека што поскоро државата ќе најде начин да ги регистрира приватните збирки на колекционерите, кои ќе бидат нивни огледала во минатото. Дотогаш локалитетот Градиште на Дреновската Клисура останува атрактивно место за дивите копачи, кои го изнесуваат националното богатство од земјата.
Зорица Атанасова

:clap:

_________________
12/21/2012 @11:11p.m. , what will happen ?

--------------------------------------------------------
1) Macedonians belong to the "older" Mediterranean substratum...
2) Macedonians are not related with geographically close Greeks, who do not belong to the "older" Mediterranenan substratum...


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PostPosted: 10 Nov 2007 18:55 
dimko-piperkata wrote:
Quote:
BARGALA

The Christian complex is contained by a 4 basilicas, 3 big and 1 small. And also there was e residence for the episcope. The city was in the part of the province middle Dachiya. In the literature is first mentioned in the year of 451 AD, in the list of the meeting of Halkedon, where the episcope Dardanius from Bargala is written right near the episcope Nikola from Stobi. The both of them were mentioned in the group of episcopes of Macedonia. Not far from Bargala was discovered the ruins of the ancient city of Astibo, near Štip.
In Macedonia were discovered around 130 basilicas in: mostly in the archeological sites, in villages and in rural places.



A naive question :

Since in 450 A.D. the inhabitants of Bargala and Stobi were fully developed Christians, then why did the Saints Kyrillos and Methodios IN THE 850'S had to RE-CHRISTIANIZE THESE SAME PEOPLE ?

OR MAY BE THEY WERE NOT THE SAME ANY MORE ?

BECAUSE 'SOMETHING' HAPPEND IN 6TH-7TH CENTIRIES ?


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PostPosted: 10 Nov 2007 19:30 
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Andreas Syggros wrote:
dimko-piperkata wrote:
Quote:
BARGALA

The Christian complex is contained by a 4 basilicas, 3 big and 1 small. And also there was e residence for the episcope. The city was in the part of the province middle Dachiya. In the literature is first mentioned in the year of 451 AD, in the list of the meeting of Halkedon, where the episcope Dardanius from Bargala is written right near the episcope Nikola from Stobi. The both of them were mentioned in the group of episcopes of Macedonia. Not far from Bargala was discovered the ruins of the ancient city of Astibo, near Štip.
In Macedonia were discovered around 130 basilicas in: mostly in the archeological sites, in villages and in rural places.



A naive question :

Since in 450 A.D. the inhabitants of Bargala and Stobi were fully developed Christians, then why did the Saints Kyrillos and Methodios IN THE 850'S had to RE-CHRISTIANIZE THESE SAME PEOPLE ?

OR MAY BE THEY WERE NOT THE SAME ANY MORE ?

BECAUSE 'SOMETHING' HAPPEND IN 6TH-7TH CENTIRIES ?

where stood that the macedonian brothers(kiril and metodij) has rechristianized the macedonians ???

any sources for that claim ??? (excluded grease sources)

_________________
12/21/2012 @11:11p.m. , what will happen ?

--------------------------------------------------------
1) Macedonians belong to the "older" Mediterranean substratum...
2) Macedonians are not related with geographically close Greeks, who do not belong to the "older" Mediterranenan substratum...


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PostPosted: 10 Nov 2007 22:02 
dimko-piperkata wrote:
where stood that the macedonian brothers(kiril and metodij) has rechristianized the macedonians ???

any sources for that claim ??? (excluded grease sources)


In all Byzantine Histories written : Ostrogorsky, Runciman, Mango etc.

There is no contact of ANY Christian Bishops from Macedonia (Thessaloniki excluded) with Constantinople for almost 150 years.
In contrast, Bishop from Stobi is mentioned to go to Consntinople in upur post.

And, generally, the Slavs of the Thessaloniki plain in 7th cent are described as pagans.


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PostPosted: 10 Nov 2007 22:06 
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Andreas Syggros wrote:
dimko-piperkata wrote:
where stood that the macedonian brothers(kiril and metodij) has rechristianized the macedonians ???

any sources for that claim ??? (excluded grease sources)


In all Byzantine Histories written : Ostrogorsky, Runciman, Mango etc.

There is no contact of ANY Christian Bishops from Macedonia (Thessaloniki excluded) with Constantinople for almost 150 years.
In contrast, Bishop from Stobi is mentioned to go to Consntinople in upur post.

And, generally, the Slavs of the Thessaloniki plain in 7th cent are described as pagans.


So do you have references that Kiril and Methodius re-christianized the population of Stobi and Bargala (as you claimed) or you don't have?

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PostPosted: 10 Nov 2007 22:21 
Antioch wrote:
So do you have references that Kiril and Methodius re-christianized the population of Stobi and Bargala (as you claimed) or you don't have?


ALL BOOKS speak about the christainization of Macedonian Slavs. Bargala and Stobi were in Macedonia. Thus they are included in the lot.

I wonder how you dare defy the fact that Slavs were pagans in the 6th 7th cent !

I hope some real Historian of yours will make the same mistake in a real alive Forum of competend Historians : These scholars need to have fun from time to time !!!


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PostPosted: 10 Nov 2007 23:32 
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Andreas Syggros wrote:
I wonder how you dare defy the fact that Slavs were pagans in the 6th 7th cent!

What do you mean "were"? Some of us still "are" paganish. ;)


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PostPosted: 11 Nov 2007 00:39 
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I explained the paganism thing on the Using Own Mind thread. Andreas simply cannot grasp the fact that Slavs are Pagans and Christians even to this day. It is more than painfully obvious he never went to a Serbian wedding or a Slava. That there were Pagans in the Balkans in the 6th and 7th century to him seems so illogical if Slavs didn't migrate, but then when did he ever used common sense logic, right? He doesn't even understand what happened in that time.

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PostPosted: 11 Nov 2007 16:06 
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Andreas Syggros wrote:
Antioch wrote:
So do you have references that Kiril and Methodius re-christianized the population of Stobi and Bargala (as you claimed) or you don't have?


ALL BOOKS speak about the christainization of Macedonian Slavs. Bargala and Stobi were in Macedonia. Thus they are included in the lot.

I wonder how you dare defy the fact that Slavs were pagans in the 6th 7th cent !

I hope some real Historian of yours will make the same mistake in a real alive Forum of competend Historians : These scholars need to have fun from time to time !!!


Look Andreas, you are the Britannica person on this forum, than stick to it to the end and show references when asked!

If you claim A+B=C than you cant say C-B is not A!!

You always answer with another answer which is often not connected with the first answer except in your fantasy world!

You claimed of re-christianization of the populations of Stobi and Bargala. This is in no way connected with christianization of the Slavs who were mainly settled around Salonika! Period!

I have yet to discover how you made your conclusion that Stobians and Bargalians were pagans and not aboriginal populations?

You must prove two things not to be called a lier speculator!

1). Bargala and Stobi were populated by majority Slavs from VII till IX C. AD who displaced the aboriginal populations.

2). These Slavs were pagans and were christianized in the same or later period.

Can you give such a proof or it was only a fantasy speculation?

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PostPosted: 11 Nov 2007 16:24 
Antioch wrote:
1). Bargala and Stobi were populated by majority Slavs from VII till IX C. AD who displaced the aboriginal populations.

2). These Slavs were pagans and were christianized in the same or later period.



1. This is the general story about the Balkans, not only these places. Can be found in any book, not only Brutannica. They Slavs did not displace, they mixed with the indigenous people, THAT is the general opinion. Not only historical but also linguistic proofs lead to this conlusion. Makedonski Jazik is a highly simplified language, compared to the much more structured and developed Serbian. It also has a unique characteristic : I has the article AFTER the noun, something to be found only in Albanina, Romanina and Bulgarian. This shows a substratum of indigenous people who left their traces into your language.
SPECIFICALLY for Bargala and Stobi : Who says that these places were so important as, say, Thessaloniki, as to be mentioned in a lot of sources ? I do not know any specific note on them, they are just in the same sack as the rest of the Balkans.

2. The Slavs of Peloponese were pagans. There is NO DOUBT about it. Slavic cemetaries with cremation habits were found, unheard off for Christians without crosses etc, in West Peloponesus and other places there. These people passed through the whole of Greece, and naturally trhough Macedonia. Why their brethren who were left behind were Christians ?

GENERAL : It is funny that you want proof fro something so commonplace among all Balkan histories !!!


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PostPosted: 11 Nov 2007 16:35 
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1. Macedonian language has been simplified only in the last 4-5 hundred years. Old Church Slavonic is the most complex Slavic language, far complex than any other Balkan language (ancient Greek is a joke compared to OCS). The oldest records of OCS is from the 10th and 11th century, that is 5 hundred years after the myth of the Slavic migration. The only other complex Indo-European languages are Baltic and ancient Sanskrit. Sanskrit being the most complex, then OCS and then Baltic. The more a language is complex the older it is, the more it is simpler it shows it has mixed with other languages and is fairly young, like Greek. The only thing Macedonian lacks is the cases, but it is more complex in other areas. The characteristically most ancient Slavic languages are Slovenian and Macedonian. Western Slavic languages are ancient-like in phonetics, Souther Slavic in grammar and vocabulary.

2. As I already repeated, Slavic warriors penetrated into Balkans. For the last timr!!! What you are saying is same with the Vikings in Britain. For the love of God!

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@AS

dont u know that history is written by winners ???
and dont u even know that the winners, ALWAYs destroy the fact of the loosers ???

creep back in ur hole :roll:

_________________
12/21/2012 @11:11p.m. , what will happen ?

--------------------------------------------------------
1) Macedonians belong to the "older" Mediterranean substratum...
2) Macedonians are not related with geographically close Greeks, who do not belong to the "older" Mediterranenan substratum...


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PostPosted: 11 Nov 2007 18:45 
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First our dear Andreas claims this:

Andreas Syggros wrote:
Since in 450 A.D. the inhabitants of Bargala and Stobi were fully developed Christians, then why did the Saints Kyrillos and Methodios IN THE 850'S had to RE-CHRISTIANIZE THESE SAME PEOPLE ?


Then when asked to give evidence about Bargala and Stobi he answers this:

Andreas Syggros wrote:
SPECIFICALLY for Bargala and Stobi : Who says that these places were so important as, say, Thessaloniki, as to be mentioned in a lot of sources ? I do not know any specific note on them, they are just in the same sack as the rest of the Balkans.


So he doesn't know, nice!

And now the formula:

Andreas is a Greek and he came from Turkey 100 years ago. Conclusion: All other Greeks also came from Turkey 100 years ago!

I like the formula, it makes the things much simpler!

Andreas Syggros wrote:
2. The Slavs of Peloponese were pagans. There is NO DOUBT about it. Slavic cemetaries with cremation habits were found, unheard off for Christians without crosses etc, in West Peloponesus and other places there. These people passed through the whole of Greece, and naturally trhough Macedonia. Why their brethren who were left behind were Christians ?


Its nice to mention it about Peloponese. See, we have found no cemeteries or any other remnants in Macedonia similar to those you have in Greece. They are non-existent! And that some Slavs were pagans is nothing new. You didn't invent the wheel!

GENERAL : You claim something you can't prove, very unprofessional and very low!

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PostPosted: 12 Nov 2007 12:42 
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Потрага по пајонскиот град Еударист

Архитектонски камени елементи од јавна градба, која во минатото била главна градска порта, можеби храм, открија археолозите на локалитетот Градиште кај Дреновската Клисура на патот Градско-Прилеп. Раководител на ископувањата е археологот Виктор Лилчиќ, професор на катедрата за археологија на Фолозофскиот факултет во Скопје. Тој вели дека трагаат по престолнината на пајонското кралство. Според него, најголемиот град во тоа кралство, Еударист, бил токму на локацијата на која се поставени првите археолошки откопи.

- Можно е токму овде да била престолнината од која раководеле пајонските кралеви. Станува збор за моќен град со површина од околу 17 хектари. Тоа бил еден од најголемите градови во кралството, град мамут - објаснува Лилчиќ.

Зачетокот на градот најверојатно треба да се бара во железното време, а најголемиот процут го имал во класичниот период. Во времето на пајонското кралство, Стоби било пајонско село во однос на Еударист.

- Ова е археолошки локалитет од прва категорија за Македонија - дециден е Лилчиќ.

Градот постоел и во римското време, а подоцна со него владеел и Крале Марко. На локалитетот биле пронајдени венециски сребреници, кои говорат дека луѓето таму живееле и во османлискиот период.

Во минатото, на Градиште биле откриени многубројни археолошки предмети од злато и од сребро, а била откопана и мермерна статуа на коњ во неговата природна големина. Но, Петре Камчевски, директор на Музеј-галеријата во Кавадарци вели дека тие одамна биле однесени од земјава.

- Некои од тие археолошки пронајдоци и денес се наоѓаат во Народниот музеј во Белград или музеите во Бугарија. Првите археолошки ископувања на локалитетот биле во 1932 година под раководство на археологот Никола Вулиќ. Истражувачите пронашле црква со мозаик, златна статуетка и многу други предмети што биле однесени во Белград - вели Камчевски.

Парите се најголем проблем што локалитетот не бил доволно истражуван во изминатите години.

- Археолошките локалитети во Македонија беа препуштени на стихијата, за разлика од другите земји во кои археолошкиот туризам носи милијарди евра - нагласува професорот Лилчиќ.

Ископувањата се реализираат во рамките на годишната програма на кавадаречкиот Музеј-галерија од Кавадарци, со дозвола од Управата за заштита на културното наследство.

http://www.dnevnik.com.mk/?ItemID=119FE ... D3755354BB

:clap:

_________________
12/21/2012 @11:11p.m. , what will happen ?

--------------------------------------------------------
1) Macedonians belong to the "older" Mediterranean substratum...
2) Macedonians are not related with geographically close Greeks, who do not belong to the "older" Mediterranenan substratum...


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PostPosted: 12 Nov 2007 18:31 
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Prehistoric women were no Ugly Bettys

Plocnik, Serbia - If the figurines found in an ancient European settlement are any guide, women have been dressing to impress for at least 7 500 years.

Recent excavations at the site - part of the Vinca culture which was Europe's biggest prehistoric civilisation - point to a metropolis with a great degree of sophistication and a taste for art and fashion, archaeologists say.

In the Neolithic settlement in a valley nestled between rivers, mountains and forests in what is now southern Serbia, men rushed around a smoking furnace melting metal for tools. An ox pulled a load of ore, passing by an art workshop and a group of young women in short skirts.

"According to the figurines we found, young women were beautifully dressed, like today's girls in short tops and mini skirts, and wore bracelets around their arms," said archaeologist Julka Kuzmanovic-Cvetkovic.

The unnamed tribe who lived between 5400 and 4700 BC in the 120-hectare site at what is now Plocnik knew about trade, handcrafts, art and metallurgy. Near the settlement, a thermal well might be evidence of Europe's oldest spa.

"They pursued beauty and produced 60 different forms of wonderful pottery and figurines, not only to represent deities, but also out of pure enjoyment," said Kuzmanovic.

The findings suggest an advanced division of labour and organisation. Houses had stoves, there were special holes for trash, and the dead were buried in a tidy necropolis. People slept on woollen mats and fur, made clothes of wool, flax and leather and kept animals.

The community was especially fond of children. Artefacts include toys such as animals and rattles of clay, and small, clumsily crafted pots apparently made by children at playtime.

One of the most exciting finds for archaeologists was the discovery of a sophisticated metal workshop with a furnace and tools including a copper chisel and a two-headed hammer and axe.

"This might prove that the Copper Age started in Europe at least 500 years earlier than we thought," Kuzmanovic said.

The Copper Age marks the first stage of humans' use of metal, with copper tools used alongside older stone implements. It is thought to have started around the 4th millennium BC in south-east Europe, and earlier in the Middle East.

The Vinca culture flourished from 5500 to 4000 BC on the territories of what is now Bosnia, Serbia, Romania and Macedonia.

It got its name from the present-day village of Vinca, 10km east of Belgrade on the Danube river, where early 20th-century excavations uncovered the remains of eight Neolithic villages.

The discovery of a mine - Europe's oldest - at the nearby Mlava river suggested at the time that Vinca could be Europe's first metal culture, a theory now backed up by the Plocnik site.

"These latest findings show that the Vinca culture was from the very beginning a metallurgical culture," said archaeologist Dusan Sljivar of Serbia's National Museum. "They knew how to find minerals, to transport them and melt them into tools."

The metal workshop in Plocnik was a room of about 25 square-meters, had wood walls coated with clay.

The furnace, built on the outside of the room, featured earthen pipe-like air vents with hundreds of tiny holes in them and a prototype chimney that ensured air went into the furnace to feed the fire and smoke came out safely.

"In Bulgaria and Cyprus, where such workshops have also been found, they didn't have chimneys but blew air on the fire with straws, exposing man to heat and carbon dioxide," Sljivar said.

He said early metal workers very likely experimented with colourful minerals that caught their eye - blue azurite, bright green malachite and red cuprite, all containing copper - as evidenced by malachite traces found on the inside of a pot.

The settlement was destroyed at some point, probably in the first part of the fifth millennium, by a huge fire.

The Plocnik site was first discovered in 1927 when the then Kingdom of Serbs, Croats and Slovenes was building a rail line from the southern city of Nis to the province of Kosovo.

Some findings were published at the time but war, lack of funds and objections from farmers meant it was investigated only sporadically until digging started in earnest in 1996.

"The saddest thing for us is always the moment when we finish our work and everything has to be covered up with earth again," Kuzmanovic said. "That's the easiest for the state, conservation is very expensive and the land owners want to work in their fields."

But there was some hope that the latest excavation would be preserved due to its importance, Kuzmanovic added.

"We dream of uncovering the entire town one day, and people will be able to see prehistoric life at its fullest," she said.

http://www.iol.co.za/index.php?set_id=1 ... 909C309000

_________________
12/21/2012 @11:11p.m. , what will happen ?

--------------------------------------------------------
1) Macedonians belong to the "older" Mediterranean substratum...
2) Macedonians are not related with geographically close Greeks, who do not belong to the "older" Mediterranenan substratum...


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PostPosted: 12 Nov 2007 19:20 
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Joined: 27 Dec 2005 12:55
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Location: annexed Macedonia (1912)
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Stone Age mini-skirts and prehistoric women with a passion for fashion

For four decades, fashion gurus have argued over the origins of the mini-skirt.

Some say Mary Quant came up with the design in the Swinging Sixties, while some point to Frenchmen Andre Courreges. Some experts even claim it made its first appearance in Hollywood 10 years earlier.

But now archaeologists say the true origins of the mini go back to the very dawn of civilisation.

They have unearthed evidence that Stone Age women were warning mini-skirts - along with short tops and bracelets - more than 7,500 years ago.

A series of stone figurines wearing the prehistoric fashions were unearthed at one of Europe's oldest known villages - a community that nestled between rivers, mountains and forests in what is now southern Siberia.

The finding pushes back the origins of fashion and art in Europe by hundreds of years to a time when our ancestors were first getting to grips with farming.

"According to the figurines we found, young women were beautifully dressed, like today's girls in short tops and mini skirts, and wore bracelets around their arms," said archaeologist Julka Kuzmanovic-Cvetkovic.

The unnamed tribe lived between 5400 and 4700 BC in the 120-hectare site at what is now Plocnik. Remains at the site reveal that they knew about trade, handcrafts, art and metallurgy while a thermal well nearby might be Europe's oldest spa.

"They pursued beauty and produced 60 different forms of wonderful pottery and figurines, not only to represent deities, but also out of pure enjoyment," said Dr Kuzmanovic.

Little is known about the life of people - known as the Vinca - who made the figurines.

The Vinca culture flourished between 5500 and 4000 BC in Bosnia, Serbia, Romania and Macedonia. It got its name from the present-day village of Vinca on the Danube River near Belgrade where eight villages have been found.

The latest discoveries suggest these early farmers had developed a sophisticated division of labour and organisation.

Houses had stoves, there were special holes for trash, and the dead were buried in a tidy necropolis. People slept on woollen mats and fur, made clothes of wool, flax and leather and kept animals.

They were especially fond of children. Artefacts include toys such as animals and rattles of clay, and small, clumsily crafted pots apparently made by children at playtime.

One of the most exciting finds for archaeologists was the discovery of a sophisticated metal workshop with a furnace and tools including a copper chisel and a two-headed hammer and axe.

"This might prove that the Copper Age started in Europe at least 500 years earlier than we thought," Dr Kuzmanovic said.

The Copper Age marks the first stage of humans' use of metal, with copper tools used alongside older stone implements. It is thought to have started around the 4th millennium BC in south-east Europe, and earlier in the Middle East.

The discovery of Europe's oldest mine at the nearby Mlava river suggested at the time that Vinca could be Europe's first metal culture, a theory now backed up by the Plocnik site.

"These latest findings show that the Vinca culture was from the very beginning a metallurgical culture," said archaeologist Dusan Sljivar of Serbia's National Museum. "They knew how to find minerals, to transport them and melt them into tools."

The metal workshop in Plocnik was a room 25 square yards, with walls built out of wood coated with clay. The furnace, built on the outside of the room, featured earthen pipe-like air vents with hundreds of tiny holes in them and a prototype chimney to ensure air goes into the furnace to feed the fire and smoke comes out safely.

In Bulgaria and Cyprus, where other workshops have been found, the early metal workers blew air on to the fire using straws rather than relying on chimneys.

They probably experimented with colourful minerals that caught their eye - blue azurite, bright green malachite and red cuprite, all containing copper.

The village was destroyed at some point, probably in the first part of the fifth millennium, by fire.

The Plocnik site was first discovered in 1927. Some findings were published at the time but war, lack of funds and objections from farmers meant it was investigated only sporadically until digging started in earnest in 1996.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/a ... ge_id=1811

_________________
12/21/2012 @11:11p.m. , what will happen ?

--------------------------------------------------------
1) Macedonians belong to the "older" Mediterranean substratum...
2) Macedonians are not related with geographically close Greeks, who do not belong to the "older" Mediterranenan substratum...


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PostPosted: 13 Nov 2007 15:14 
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Joined: 30 Jun 2005 11:01
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cool! thanks dimko :clap:


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PostPosted: 15 Nov 2007 07:53 
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http://www.dnevnik.com.mk/?ItemID=0B8D00FC6E503D4EABF1EF7BFE981C06


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