Here is another interresting article from July 1910. Macedonian is mentioned as a separate race in Turkey in Europe, Bulgaria and Greece, used by the United States Bureau of Immigration since 1899 .

Here we go again..... lets start the DENIAL GAME. You know who you are, ready... set... GOOOO!



The article is called "The Economic Investigations of the United States Immigration Commission" by W. Jett Lauck, published in "The Journal of Political Economy", Vol. 18, No. 7, (Jul., 1910), pp. 525-549. This is from page 527.


Remember......
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thx @jordane

Nishto, nishto.... tuka sum da ja kazham vistinatat, PRAVDA za MAKEDONIJA!

I wonder where is the problem. From the middle 19th century several learned people began to differentiate themeslves from the Bulgars. So, in 1899, some peasants immigrating to America declared "Macedonians". Some of them, as Brailsford remarked, did not know anything else except that they were from Macedonia.

Take into account that the Bulgars, who began to awake at the end of 18th-beginning of 19th century, managed in 15 years to become the "Prussians of the Balkans" [In 1870 they managed to have the Exarchate, in 1885 they had a State and conquered Eastern Rumelia overnight]. No doubt, the Bulgars were supported by the Russians, and in the case of swallowing Eastern Rumelia, by the Brittish. The Brittish stance stopped the Sultan from intervening militarily. The Serbs were shocked enough, and declared war. But they were defeated, although numerically stronger.

You were very slow. A paper from the American Imm. Office could not give you freedom. And Iliden was partly, at least, supported by the Bulgars, who had different ideas about you.

P.S.: I have some pages containing alleged evidence about the continuous existence of the Macedonian nation throughout the centuries. I vcan post them at request. I have aquired them from a site called, if I remember well, HistoryofMacedonia.org. I never cared to find if they were fakes or insignificant.
The funny thing is that in this site there were (some years ago) fiery articles stating "WE are not Slavs!".
Now, most people in this FORUM adhere to the Paleoslavic Theory, the Minoans being Slavs etc.

I follow the way the cooler of the Westerners have paved : Macedonian national identity began to be forged from the middle 19th century. Today it is a reality. Therefore you have the rights of all other nationalities.

As for the historical problems, i.e. what was the ancient Macedonian language, who were the ancient Macs, if the Greeks are more or less mixed, if the Slavic migrations were real or a myth, they have to be studied with cool head. Todays political realities and State borders are stable for 100 years. The only thing that has to be resolved is the rights of minorities (yours) and the name issue. In cool blood.

Andrew, you must really hate us to try and deny our identity every time a very interesting post like this comes up.

Do you accept that "nationalism" is a relatively recent event?
Do you agree that the Republic of Venice makes greece look like it was created a couple of weeks ago?
Do you think the Macedonian national identity was created overnight?

thanks

the document is dated 1899, gee that tito was an amazing even supernatural person able to create nationality retrospectively.

So this is the new greek tactics, we do exist but from 19 Century . But I thought Tito invented us

I always lough reading such nonsence over and over from people who was lucky to occupy part of the Macedonian land...

Does anyone here have any idea of when the term Servian was discontinued?
Or of when the term Greek was first used?
When the term Romanoi was discontinued?
When the term Hellene was discontinued?

I am curious to know. I also believe the latter of the three are mutually exclusive.

(1)
No, Antioch. This is my opinion, based on foreign, not Greek sources. Greek sources do insist that Tito invented you.

I quoted MISHA GLENNY, where he explicitly says that, a cool-headed Westerner would have the idea that I presented. If you thnk you have enough arguments, try to convince the Westerners. I remind you that, whenever I quoted Western sources ( even OSTROGORSKY and VASILEF, Serb and Russian !!), and I didi it 100 times, you were unanimous in labelling them "not credible".

(2)
We were lucky, but in wars lasting 10 years, where we lost more than 500.000 people. You were unlucky, and slow in reaction, and now you have only 10-50.000 compatriots in the Aegean.

Is it me that hates you, or persons like you, S_o_M and some others, who in every post label Greeks as :
Christian Turks, Vlachs, Albanians etc.

And you have to brush your English.

When I say that your nationality is A REALITY today, and began aweking in the mid 19th century, you call this A DENIAL ?

Once I answered to you, we don't have to convince anybody anymore!!!

You think Macedonians exist from 19 Century and I NOW you are very wrong. We never stopped to exist from Phillips time till today; Macedonian ethnicity (in different national forms) was always majority in Macedonia.

Regardless of everything at the end you will still be Prosfigi Greek and I will still be Macedonian...

Eifersucht ist eine Leidenschaft, die mit Eifer sucht, was Leiden schaft.

Sorry, my German is not so good to understand your sentence, but I suppose its something "clever"...

I am sorry, I have mistaken you for another member of the FORUM, who posted some exerpts of Karl Marx in German.

It means :
"Jealusy is a passion, that pasionetely pursues what brings pains'

In German the words sound much better.

Americans are as the Byzantines.They have geographical and ethnological problems. Eleven years after this immigration nota make a new one....

137. Do not write "Macedonian," but write Bulgarian, Turkish, Greek, Servian, or Roumanian, as the case may be.

http://www.ucc.ie/staff/jprodr/macedonia/smodusa.htm

Olympias

Incredible, but taken into account the recent ignorance of Americans as to which is their capital, understandable.

But I still stick to my opinion, formed after reading many FOREIGN books and papers on the Balkans :
The Macedonian national identity began to awake at the mid 19th century. It was alive during WW-I and came into being after WW-II. TITO did not invent this identity, he supported it.
But contemporary Macs go to extremes.

Agree with your quote Andreas Syggros as about the Macedonian national identity.

Olympias

I am so TIRED to read this crap repeated in ABSURDUM by NEOHELLENS..... are you all a race of PARROTS, cant you people use your own brain for ones and not share it amongst you. WAKE UP.... HELLLOOOOOOOOOOOO!


Please read this carefully now... PLEASE UNDERSTAND what it says.....



Accordind to the UNITED STATES BUREAU OF IMMIGRATION 1899 Macedonians existed.



According to this document "1910 Census: Instructions to Enumerators" Macedonian should be replaced by either of the listed instead:



According to the same document but 10 years later there are MACEDONIANS, "1920 Census: Instructions to Enumerators",



And we are NOTICED again in this document "1920 Data Entry Operator's Manual" both by birthplace, MACEDONIA and by language MACEDONIAN.



And last but not least in this document "1930 Census: Enumerator Instructions" as MACEDONIAN again!




So, something happened in 1910, what happened??
Macedonians existed in 1899, 1920 and in 1930 versions of the censuses. Isnt it strange that you happend picked the one of 1910 and "missed" the other three stating the OPPOSITE.

Instead of sharing a brain with your fellow NEOHELLENS could for ones(in your life maybe) use your OWN?
Can you please TELL ME why MACEDONIAN is not an appropriate language in the 1910 census???
PLEASE ANSWER that, bytheway use your own brain and not Istors or Syggros or anybody elses.... m'kay.....



Imbeciles will never UNDERSTAND that.......
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A blind man leading another blind man is never good.

The Encyclopedia Brit., 1888AD, “In race, as in geographical position, the Thessalians held an intermediate place between the non-Hellenic Macedonians and the Greeks of pure blood.”