From Vinozito's web page:

http://www.florina.org...

WHO SAYS THERE ARE NO MINORITY LANGUAGES IN GREECE?

It is widely known that Greece refuses to acknowledge the existence of national minorities and minority languages. Similarly, in the Greek census of 1961, 1971, 1981 and 1991 any mention of one's mother tongue is absent. This is not by chance but, rather, a deliberate policy of the Greek government. In the earlier census of 1940 and 1951 one can find such declarations as "Slavic" language. Whereas, in the census of 1928 one can find a language declaration of "Slav Macedonian."

However, in the census of 1920, immediately after Greece's acquisition of the "New Territories" the government of the day offers some revealing information. In the census of 19 December, 1920, the official Greek census form had a separate area asking: "what is your mother tongue? What is the language you speak at home? If your mother tongue is not Greek do you understand Greek? This census document can be found in the book by M. Houliarakis (Geografiki, dioikitiki kai plithismiaki ekseliksi tis Ellados tom G' page 363)

The data obtained from the census of 1920 offers great detail about the population to the point of distinguishing between deaf males and deaf females. It also includes the data on language and mother tongue.
Unfortunately, the census information relating to the population of the "New Territories" was never made public. This information preceded the exchanges of Christian and Muslim populations between Turkey and Greece or the so-called "voluntary" population exchanges between Greece and Bulgaria.

At that time Greece only published the results from the geographic area of "old Greece" (Sterea, Evoia, Thessalia, Arta, Ionian Islands, Cyclades, Peloponese...). Five volumes containing census data from the "New Territories," which included information on religion and language, were prohibited from being made public.

In the archives of the Census Council or the General Archives of the Greek state we shall not find census data on the northern territories (the new territories of Macedonia and Western Thrace) for the census period of 1920.

However, page 182 of the volume of census data for 1920 (published in 1929) for the area of Trikala (in Thessaly and Arta just south of the new territories) the following linguistic categories are reported for mother tongue:

Greek, Spanish, Romi, Koutsovlach, Albanian, Bulgarian, Serbian and 37 individuals from Trikala who declared their mother tongue as Macedonian.

http://www.florina.org...

This is official census data published by the Greek government wherein, not only is the Macedonian language documented by the census authority but it is rightly distinguished from Bulgarian and Serbian.
One can now appreciate why the 1920 census results for the "New Territories" have gone missing.

We would like to thank Mr. Dimitrios Lithoksoou for uncovering this data, which we published in Volume 5 of our magazine, Nova Zora (New Dawn). Mr. Lithoksoou has his own Web site with several pages of interest to the Macedonians of Greece.

Bravo Filipe,

Excellent post Filip.

Well done Filip ... as always ... pure gold.
It should also be noted that those declaring as serbs or bulgarians (probably greek as well) were most likely being a little too smart for their own purposes. No doubt they spoke chisto makedonski.

Risto the Great

Dobro e Filipe.

It doesn't matter which language they spoke, they must be all "Greek"

In such instances, the term Greek stand for Christian, as opposed to Turk which is Muslim.

I have read a few passages online from old manuscripts during the crusades passage through the balkan regions. I have read a few names of certain "greeks" that were not greek at all. Do you think that it was often that christians were just associated with the term "Greek" this far back in time?

And I really cannot understand the actions of my Govt.

As I have mentioned and quoted, MIRIVILIS clearly says that in 1917, during WW-I, he met peasants in Macedonia calling themseleves :
"Not Grtsk, not Srp, not Balgar but Macedonians".

So it was quite natural to find people declaring their language Macedonian in 1929.

I have explained the efforts of Greece to name the Slav-speakers either Bulgarians or Serbs, meeting each time the vehement reaction of Yugoslavia [ then as Kingdom of Serbs and Croats ] or Bulgaria respectively.

A little bravery was needed to recognise the minority as Slav-Macedonians. This, with the aid of the League of Nations, would have resolved the problem for ever. Today, 100-150.000 people would be speaking their language and having minority rights.

But the League of Nations was very week, Greek politicians avoided internal troubles [ the National Schism between Liberals and Royalists was at its peak ] and the result was that these people were persecuted by Metaxas, made the wrong decision to side with the Commies, their numbers dwindled to 30.000 aprox., and now we have the current problems.

exactly...for instance greek-catholic church is a church that recognize pope as main authority but use byzantin liturgic tradition...here are list of greek-catholic churches around the world:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Greek_Catholics

so greek in many cases stands for ortodox christian, regardless of ethnic background...

recently i argued with one fool that claimed that all members of gc church are greeks :)

Thank you Bosnian. Everyone on here should read that link.

Andrea.
The "slav" Macedonians were the only Macedonians at that time and still are. The Greek Macedonian fantasy had not been born yet. The Greek mission was to cleanse anything Macedonian out of Agean Macedonia.
80% of the endopio population of Agean Macedonia spoke Slavic Macedonian Before the Greeks arrived.

NO, NOT aacording to RoM Govt. Please see my older posts on SIMOVSKI. State RoM editions, 1978.

Oh please, Andreas, the first set of Turkish Profyges even learned to speak Macedonian that's how widespread it was. The Jews, Vlach, Arvanites, even the Hellenised populations spoke it as well.

It's quite the miracle of 'instant Hellenism' that this long-dominant language no longer exists in the Aegean part of Macedonia yet is readily found in the other contiguous parts.

I like your wishful thinking. According to Mazower, and my granma's narrations, in pre-WW-II Thessaloniki most people knew a little Ladino. Most Jews just spoke broken Greek, better Turkish and nothing else.

In Thessaloniki, before 1912, the lingua Franca was Spanish Ladino. The total amount of Bulgarians (they were calling themselves so, they had a Bulgarian High School also) was [around,all] 10.000, that of Greeks 25.000, Jews 60.000 and Turks 50.000.

Why on earth should anybody learn Macedonian ?

Being, according to SIMOVSKI, just 29% of the Aegean Population ?

You deny your own country's official books ????????

Yes, I was having a meal in a kafana in greece and noticed a group of people dining and speaking Macedonian. I sat with them for a while and noticed a strange guarded level in the discussions. Clearly there was a spy or some kind of traitor in the group. Something only a "nash" could perceive.

Well, after one (rather dark) individual left, the conversation soon opened up. It would appear the "dark person" was one of those turkish imports who spoke perfect Macedonian. Go figure. None of the Macedonian people trusted him. Surely this import did not learn the language to be a spy??? He clearly wanted to fit in ... I hope. Interesting to note that it was 2006 when this happened.

Risto the Great

Thanks for passing that on to my friend RTG, Vergina...I'm sure RTG will now hate me and have me evicted from the Macedonian fold because I have a passionate view about a certain matter...you know...unlike the greax, who are so understanding about opposing viewpoints...

Oh, and Vergina...just incase you missed my point in your mad rush to quote me and post it here...I wouldn't give those bastards (i.e. the modern grk) one single cent of my money...fuck them, bloody racist, xenophobic motherfuckers...

You do realise vergina, that RtG went to parts of Greece where there are mostly ethnic Macedonians. In fact, that cafe was probably Macedonian owned. Please correct me if i'm wrong RtG.

While you have so obviously tried to openly create a conflict, you have most definitely failed. What we have seen however, is this negative side to your personality. I could think of a few words that you should look up.

Thanks MKD...obviously the point wasn't lost on you...why the hell would I complain about Macedonians visiting their ancestral homelands and supporting Macedonians in Greece...MY POINT was strictly about visiting other parts of NON-MACEDONIAN LANDS that today have been annexed by a foreign entity...My views are quite passionate on this subject...and like so many Macedonians on this board I too have roots in Aegean Macedonia...

I find it extremely difficult to 'respect' a nation that has shown no respect to the Macedonian people, a country that is one of the most xenophobic in all of Europe...why the hell should I spend my money there...???

Fuck 'em...

Let it be said that RTG does not contribute to the greek economy in any meaningful way whatsoever. Having said that, Macedonians in greece have enjoyed the effects of his discretionary spending and have sampled his great wealth.

Phoenix, we are no longer friends. But having fought a few wars together, how can we not look out for one another. Actually, we are still friends ... did you get that pretty bracelet I sent you? ... you know, the one made from greek intestines?

Risto the Great