UN Minorities Rights Report on Greece 2008 has been Released

Rogi · **Posted:** 08 Mar 2009 03:30

Koufalas, please stop signing up with multiple-names. This is your 4th currently active username on this forum. Stick to one, don't make yourself out to be multiple people. Let me know which one you would like to keep and I will remove the rest.

Makedonska_Kafana · **Posted:** 08 Mar 2009 03:39

NEW GREEK = Koufala

TrueMacedonian · **Joined:** 14 Apr 2005 01:32 **Posts:** 4846

Koufalas wrote:

I think this report is dramatically in favor of Greece.

I mean it establishes that ancient Macedonia is Greek
It establishes a continuity between ancient and modern Macedonia and that it is Greek

Quote:

The Kingdom of Ancient Macedonia is part of the Hellenic historical and cultural heritage

It establishes that the majority of people in Macedonia in Greece are Greeks

Quote:

with a population of primarily ethnic Greeks

It slaps Greece on the hand with a minor mention about it's treatment of minorities which presents as insignificant in number.

We look at this in isolation. Why would a German or a French or an English even bother to look at this report when looking across Europe they have massive minority and economic problems. See Germany with the neo-Nazi and the Turks, Spain with the Basques, Italy with the north hating the south and the Albanians, France with the Arabs and the blacks, Belgium much like Germany but with more Mulsims. England with the Pakis ... ever been to Birmingham. The English have given up ...

How could we even think this report good in any way ?!?! I think it is as bad as the Ohrid Agreement.
Greeks can and will use it as a base of facts to start negotiation with.

Quote:

40. The Kingdom of Ancient Macedonia is part of the Hellenic historical and cultural heritage,
reclaimed by modern Greece, and with a population of primarily ethnic Greeks, despite
linguistic variations due to historical influence. The government points to the archaeological
sites including Vergina, where tombs of King Phillip II and Alexander IV dating back to
the 3rd Century BC were unearthed in the 1970s. Artefacts including these tombs display ancient Greek inscriptions considered by the government to confirm that the region and its people are historically Greek.12

I'm sure no one in the U.N. are really that educated about history. Especially about your speculative recent history. Because if they were they'd be asking modern "greeks" why it is their first president was an Albanian who didn't speak a word of Romaika.
O.K. explain to us how the re-settled asians and whatever else that had to be re-settled in Occupied Aegean Macedonia makes them related to the ancient Macedonians? Surely it can't be by blood (I know you ain't that dumb to go there). And it surely can't be by culture because we know the Karamanlis lived a very Turkish lifestyle. So tell us how are these multi-cultural people related to the ancient Macedonians? :idn

Mikail · **Posted:** 08 Mar 2009 04:04

TrueMacedonian wrote:

Koufalas wrote:

I think this report is dramatically in favor of Greece.

I mean it establishes that ancient Macedonia is Greek
It establishes a continuity between ancient and modern Macedonia and that it is Greek

Quote:

The Kingdom of Ancient Macedonia is part of the Hellenic historical and cultural heritage

It establishes that the majority of people in Macedonia in Greece are Greeks

Quote:

with a population of primarily ethnic Greeks

It slaps Greece on the hand with a minor mention about it's treatment of minorities which presents as insignificant in number.

We look at this in isolation. Why would a German or a French or an English even bother to look at this report when looking across Europe they have massive minority and economic problems. See Germany with the neo-Nazi and the Turks, Spain with the Basques, Italy with the north hating the south and the Albanians, France with the Arabs and the blacks, Belgium much like Germany but with more Mulsims. England with the Pakis ... ever been to Birmingham. The English have given up ...

How could we even think this report good in any way ?!?! I think it is as bad as the Ohrid Agreement.
Greeks can and will use it as a base of facts to start negotiation with.

Quote:

40. The Kingdom of Ancient Macedonia is part of the Hellenic historical and cultural heritage,
reclaimed by modern Greece, and with a population of primarily ethnic Greeks, despite
linguistic variations due to historical influence. The government points to the archaeological
sites including Vergina, where tombs of King Phillip II and Alexander IV dating back to
the 3rd Century BC were unearthed in the 1970s. Artefacts including these tombs display ancient Greek inscriptions considered by the government to confirm that the region and its people are historically Greek.12

I'm sure no one in the U.N. are really that educated about history. Especially about your speculative recent history. Because if they were they'd be asking modern "greeks" why it is their first president was an Albanian who didn't speak a word of Romaika.
O.K. explain to us how the re-settled asians and whatever else that had to be re-settled in Occupied Aegean Macedonia makes them related to the ancient Macedonians? Surely it can't be by blood (I know you ain't that dumb to go there). And it surely can't be by culture because we know the Karamanlis lived a very Turkish lifestyle. So tell us how are these multi-cultural people related to the ancient Macedonians? :idn

Well said TM :clap:

.... Or even the ancient Greeks for that matter :??

TrueMacedonian · **Joined:** 14 Apr 2005 01:32 **Posts:** 4846

The ancient Hellenes would laugh at todays imposter Hellene like we do :lol

Koufalas · **Joined:** 18 Feb 2009 09:12 **Posts:** 175

I am not saying the UN knows history at all or that they even care.
In diplomacy not even the truth is important.

This report is dramatically in favor of Greece. It got a small slap in the wrist about it's treatment of minorities.
I would be the first to say that it is important for any country to respect its minorities

Then it supports Greece on its historical and territorial positions.
What more in its wildest dreams could Greece ask for in such a report ?

PS: You can get rid of KYP, that was me being a bit of a clown in the quest for a secret agent.
This is my login I would like to keep

maknews · **Posted:** 08 Mar 2009 09:04

Well, if you think this report is positive for Greece, then that's fine by me.

Mikail · **Posted:** 08 Mar 2009 12:56

Koufalas wrote:

I am not saying the UN knows history at all or that they even care.
In diplomacy not even the truth is important.

This report is dramatically in favor of Greece. It got a small slap in the wrist about it's treatment of minorities.
I would be the first to say that it is important for any country to respect its minorities

Then it supports Greece on its historical and territorial positions.
What more in its wildest dreams could Greece ask for in such a report ?

PS: You can get rid of KYP, that was me being a bit of a clown in the quest for a secret agent.
This is my login I would like to keep

Do you really think the report supports Greece because of that one nonsensical paragraph, out of a 26 page report of Greece, or, does the author add that paragraph in order to demonstrate that Greece is attempting to uphold an irrational argument.

One can look at the report in many different aspects, yet there are 26 pages not in Greece's favour whatsoever. In this regard, can you look at it as being dramatically in favour of Greece, simply giving Greece a small slap in the wrist about it's treatment of minorities.

The writer gives mention to previous small slaps which Greece has ignored. Perhaps there is more in this that meets the eye. This may well be a bigger slap than we all think.

And Koufalas, the UN did take the time out to send someone there in the first place. That someone is a specialist in such issues and would not be concerned with the current economic climate the world faces. The UN has other specialists to be concerned with such matters.

Mikail · **Posted:** 08 Mar 2009 13:23

BBC-interview with Panayote Dimitras - spokesman of the Greek Helsinki Monitor about the discrimination of the minorities in Greece
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sZxg2o7Y ... re=related

Mikail · **Posted:** 08 Mar 2009 13:29

Panayote Dimitras part 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n1mZKt7u ... re=related

Panayote Dimitras part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6XYbLMKP ... re=related

maknews · **Posted:** 08 Mar 2009 19:13

Dimitras is amazing, he is a rare Greek indeed.

Mikail · **Posted:** 08 Mar 2009 22:40

maknews wrote:

Dimitras is amazing, he is a rare Greek indeed.

That he is

machorot · **Joined:** 04 Oct 2008 22:55 **Posts:** 73

Koufalas wrote:

I am not saying the UN knows history at all or that they even care.
In diplomacy not even the truth is important.

This report is dramatically in favor of Greece. It got a small slap in the wrist about it's treatment of minorities.
I would be the first to say that it is important for any country to respect its minorities

Then it supports Greece on its historical and territorial positions.
What more in its wildest dreams could Greece ask for in such a report ?

PS: You can get rid of KYP, that was me being a bit of a clown in the quest for a secret agent.
This is my login I would like to keep

I'd have to agree that the section about the Macedonian minority is adamantly in Greece's favour.

What you guys are failing to realise, is that the report about 'Ethnic identity in the region of Florina', opens with a Greek sponsered historical claim, and basically says that the 'Macedonian minority' is the creation of Tito's myth of a Macedonian nation.

What more could the Greeks ask for in that respect? You just watch how they will use this against us.

Bushav · **Posted:** 10 Mar 2009 04:16

Kouflas, if you read the language carefully you'll find that the ancient Macedonian Kingdom was a part of the ancient Hellenic history and culture in the same way that the Ottoman Empire was part of the modern neo-Greek culture. That is, the ancient Greeks were ruled by the Macedonian Kingdom. That makes the Macedonian kingdom a part of ancient Hellenic history, but it does not imply that the occupied party can claim ownership of their occupier. In fact, this link is laughable.

The next point is that it says that greece reclaims this ancient hellenic history. That is two weak links to try to claim ownership of an ancient Kingdom which owned and occupied ancient Greece. It is a pitiful attempt at making yourself feel good. In the mean time, keep numbering photos of human rights activists and then intimidating them, fools!
:lol

maknews · **Posted:** 10 Mar 2009 06:02

The UN was foolish to enter such comments into the report.

They aren't factual, they aren't observed, they are merely the claims of a government charged with racism. These claims are nothing more than historical revisionism and mythology and can be easily disproven.

To include them only soils the report and indicates the UN has allowed the report to be manipulated.

UN Minorities Rights Report on Greece 2008 has been Released

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