The Macedonian Digest
“From the readers for the readers”
Edition 33 – September 2008
======oOo======
Editor’s Notes
It's with regret that I have learned that my country and my countrymen and women will be referred to as Former Yugoslav Macedonians at the Olympic Games in Beijing.
One gets the impression that we don't have a name, that our identity is unknown even to ourselves.
I read in today’s Macedonian newspapers that some parties insisted that we should be referred to in the same way as our country was entered in the UN.
I want to remind you that the name in the UN was meant to be a temporary reference to allow us to become a member in the UN. It was never intended to be a solution or an official name for our country just because Greece opposes our constitutional name.
We have a constitutional name; it’s the Republic of Macedonia. It is our official name which we have inherited and which closely ties us to our inherited identity, our Macedonian identity, which was used to name our country.
Like every nation in the world we would like to exercise our human rights and our self-identification rights. We would like to be called what we call ourselves and not what others called us in the past, call us today, or would like to call us in the future.
The constitutional and official name of our country is Republic of Macedonia, our national identity is Macedonian and it is our right to insist that those facts be respected.
The temporary reference used to allow us to enter the UN has nothing to do with how we name our athletes who will compete in the Olympic Games. Those who insist that we use the reference instead of our name do not respect our human rights and our right to self-identification and that is totally against what the Olympic Games stands for.
Why degrade a little country just because a bigger country doesn’t like its name? Does this mean that the little country’s athletes can’t compete on equal terms?
It's sad when politics become part of games where athletes are not treated as equals.
Therefore, in the spirit of sportsmanship, and in respect of our human rights, I hope that you will reconsider and refer to my country as Republic of Macedonia and to my countrymen and women as Macedonians.
Respectfully,
Zan Dukovski.
Feature Stories
Westminster
College of London becomes EURM
http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/2126/1/
Close to 1,000 students and 20 professors of Westminster
College in London became part of European University Republic of Macedonia
(EURM).
EURM was the first private University in Macedonia, which has grown and
expanded over the years. It is the first time a Macedonian Private University
opens a campus and expands beyond the Macedonian borders.
The cost of this purchase - expansion is not known, though EURM has been
in negotiations with Westminster College close to three years. It wasn't the
fee, rather the many laws, norms and regulations that needed to be followed so
the EURM and Westminster College align with Macedonian and British Laws.
"During our negotiations, we had requested of Westminster College
to follow all of EURM's teaching norms. Practically, today Westminster College
doesn't exist. Instead, in London there is a European University of Republic
of Macedonia," says Bojo Andreski, president of EURM.
EURM offers undergraduate, as well as graduate (masters and doctoral) studies.
Currently there are three Faculties at EURM-London:
1 - The Faculty of Economic Sciences, which will bear the name "St Nicholas"
2 - The Faculty of Information & Technology which will bear the name "Alexander
the Macedonian",
3 - The Faculty of Art & Design, which will bear the name "Phillip
II"
"For the incoming year, we have had 2,500 applicants, however, the
1,200 sq. meters don't allow us to accept this many students, we are working
on plans to expand. EURM is also negotiating with Oxford University. I have been
speaking to numerous individuals and professors at Oxford, I'd be extremely happy
for EURM to expand and open a wing at Oxford University. Currently, Macedonian
as well as British students can study in Skopje or London, it is essentially
the same thing, they will get the same EURM diploma." concluded Mr. Andreski.
Not another BIG Greek Lie?
http://www.greeknewsonline.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=8974&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_American
Hi Risto
In the above link shown is typical Greek propaganda (check out the end
of the article) where Greeks claim there are about 3 million Greek Americans.
The second link shows the last 3 censuses. In the 1980 US Census 959,856
Greeks were registered. In the 1990 US Census there were 1,110,292
Greeks and the 2000 US Census there were 1,152,956 Greeks registered.
When it comes to making big statements Greek lobby groups in the US come
out with this 3 million Greeks in America that don’t exist. There is no statistical
evidence anywhere to support this and they use these numbers to intimidate US
Politicians. Come to think of it it’s a bit like "there is no Macedonian
minority in Greece" according to the Greek Government but somehow there
are 3 million Greeks in America that no Census can account for. [That makes a
lot of Greek sense]
Risto, these lies need to be exposed to the world. I hope you can take
this up with the Greeks and ask them to please explain where they get the 3 million?
Have a good day.
GM
There are claims that Macedonian territories used to belong to the magna Grecia based on historical scripts
Also that under the Byzantine/Easter Rome rule, Macedonia was ruled as part of northern Greece and that indigenous Macedonian Greeks were persecuted and fled under the Ottomans, etc.
What is 'Magna Grecia' ? An idea? A reality? How did people self identity before they were told they were 'Greeks' before a Greek national consciousness barely emerged in the 1830's? Who told them they were Greeks, and if they had not been told, who would they be now?
How can Macedonia be ruled as part of 'Northern Greece' when 'Northern Greece' in the 1830's was a border just north of the Peloponnesus? What a gross misstatement! This is just another attempt to manipulate information and rob and cheat the Macedonians of their history and heritage. This is typical colonial discourse, regarding Macedonia and the Macedonians. Go to the other colonizers of traditional Macedonian land, i.e., the Bulgarians. They will tell you the same thing. That Macedonia is part of the 'greater Bulgarian geopolitical tradition'. The Serbians will say the same. But, we know that Modern Greeks, you and I, had no sense of identity, national feeling or even a common ancestry, just a few short centuries ago, so all this talk about 'Macedonia being Greek' is missing the point. Behind the 'Macedonia is Greek' lie is the idea that Modern Greeks all have the same common ancestry, history and heritage, which is of course a complete lie. Because the term 'Greek' is so loosely applied to just about anyone, and then so narrowly defined, it can capture just about anyone in its net, and give them a brand new heritage, nicely packaged. This is what sociologists and spin doctors do. And why empirically minded historians have had such a tough time with Modern Greek history. It's a history of identity fraud, manipulation, anachronisms, a history of bizarre myth making and, various other forms of 'social' construction. Before the 'catastrophe' the better part of Turkey was also 'Greek' but 'who knows' what they meant by that at that time? Russian Orthodox Pontians, Kartvelian speaking Greek Orthodox, Turkish speaking Armenian Orthodox, Turkish speaking Christian (Greek) Orthodox? There has never been a clear idea of what it means to have a 'Greek heritage' let alone a people declaring they are Greeks 'and' Macedonians! What a load of garbage.
By Paul
Does this flag look familiar?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_East_India_Company
Hi Risto,
I thought this would be of interest to you. Greeks would claim that it
is a pure coincidence or maybe they had this flag first, although they adopted
this flag in 22/12/1978. Funny thing is they have adopted the same formula, change
the symbol into a national flag, changed the
colour from red to blue to make it "Hellenic", just like the star
of Kutlesh. Maybe they can blame Tito for this as well.
Maybe you would like to add it to the Macedonian Digest for the readers.
Steven
From the International Scene
What can the Aegean Macedonians Learn from the Kven and Sami Peoples of Norway
By Sam Vaknin
Author of "Malignant Self Love - Narcissism Revisited"
The phrase "minority rights" conjures abhorrent images of Palestinians tortured in Israeli prisons; Aegean Macedonians expelled from Greece or incarcerated on remote islands, there to perish; and Native-Americans confined to wasteland "reservations", having been decimated for decades. But, the sad truth is that minorities are welcome nowhere and that every single nation harbors embarrassing skeletons in its historical closet.
Consider Norway, by far the least plausible candidate for the role of perpetrators of genocide, physical or cultural. This remote Scandinavian polity has repeatedly won every conceivable prize for upholding and cherishing human rights. Yet, it, too, has a dark chapter that ended only recently.
During the 18th and 19th centuries, many Finns - destitute farmers and fishermen - emigrated from their homeland and from Sweden and settled in the inhospitable northern reaches of Norway. They joined the original inhabitants of that area, Finns known as Sami. The new arrivals came to be known as Kvener (in Norwegian), Kvenee (in their own Finnish dialect), or simply Kven, by everyone else.
Fully one quarter of the population in the north identified themselves as Kven in the census of 1875 - yet, it took their adopted country two centuries (and a parliamentary investigative committee) to recognize them a minority (in 1996) and to accept their right to use their language (in 2005) within the framework of the European Charter for Regional or Minority Languages.
Still, this may have been too little, too late. In the intervening period, the word "Kven" has been used as a pejorative by the Kvens' upstanding "ethnically pure Norwegian" compatriots. Kven and Sami culture and languages were considered backward and inferior (with racist undertones). Across the border, in Sweden, Samis were compulsorily sterilized.
In Norway, the Kven and Sami were re-labeled "The Foreign Nations" (non-Nordic, of Mongol roots) and "The Original Immigrants" (a falsification of history, as the Norwegians were the immigrants, not the Sami).
The mandate of the "Finn Fund", established in the 19th century by the Norwegian National Assembly, called on it to "civilize" the Kven and the Sami. Even after World War II, as Norway sought to "modernize" itself, Kven and Sami civilizations were cast as outdated and primitive.
Consequently, many Kvens now claim counterfactually to be Norwegians (or merely Norwegian Finns) and consider the Kven language to be a dialect of Finnish.
Inevitably, in a nationalistic backlash, some Kven now insist that they are the aborigines of northern Europe and that once, in the 11th century, they ran an empire that covered most of northern Scandinavia. Groups of opportunistic Swedish Finns support these theories in an attempt to leverage the ILO 169 Convention about the Rights of Indigenous People and apply it to Sweden's Kvens.
Be that as it may, the truth is that Norway had made it exceedingly difficult for Kvens (and other Finns, such as the Sami people) to obtain citizenship or maintain it and literally impossible to buy real estate - unless they agreed to change their names, give up their language and culture and, later, move away from sensitive border areas (they were considered pro-Russian, then pro-German and, therefore, a security risk). Additionally, lands in the public domain (in truth, owned by the Sami and Kven) were declared to be state property and confiscated without compensation.
This discriminatory policy was known as fornorskningspolitikken (Norwegianization).
Thus, for instance, well into the 1950s, it was forbidden to teach the Sami language in schools (with a few exceptions in the 1930s and 1940s). The very existence of the Sami nation (as a minority) was acknowledged only in 1989, after massive demonstrations in 1979 (ostensibly against the construction of an environmentally-disruptive dam, but actually to air Sami grievances).
Only in the 1990s were some of the wrongs righted: the Sami language was declared a "national treasure" (and a second official language in Norway), a Sami parliament was established, and lands appropriated by the state were returned to the Sami people.
The Kven are envious of the Samis' achievements. Well into the 1990s, they were still being labeled "immigrants" (and not a minority) by the Norwegian state.
In 1987, they established The Norwegian Kven Organization. Its aims are both political and cultural: the ultimate compilation of a government report about the Kven population; liaising with the Norwegian media; to push for the establishment of a State Secretary for Kven issues; to further the knowledge of the Kven language, from the kindergarten level onwards, using the proceeds of a Kven culture fund and income from museums and culture centers. The Kven also demand bilingual signage and place names.
Yet, only after Norway ratified, in 1999, the Council of Europe's Framework Convention for the Protection of National Minorities, did it reluctantly alter the Kvens' status and accept that they are a "national minority": a collective with a historical presence (longer than 100 years) in a given territory. Now, only Norway and Canada (and maybe Australia) maintain a three-tiered hierarchy of "nations": indigenous, minority, and immigrants.
Even so, Norway is light years ahead of countries
such as Israel and Greece who completely deny the existence of their minorities.
Israel had insisted until quite recently that the Palestinian "nation" is
an invention and the Greeks refuse to this very day to accept the existence
of a Macedonian minority (or any other non-Greeks, for that matter) on
Greek soil.
Sam Vaknin ( http://samvak.tripod.com )
is the author of Malignant Self Love - Narcissism Revisited and After the
Rain - How the West Lost the East.
He served as a columnist for Global Politician, Central Europe Review, PopMatters,
Bellaonline, and eBookWeb, a United Press International (UPI) Senior Business
Correspondent, and the editor of mental health and Central East Europe categories
in The Open Directory and Suite 101.
Visit Sam's Web site at http://samvak.tripod.com
Issues
VMRO to hunt for "traitors"
http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/2092/1/
VMRO DPMNE has announced the creation of "threes" that
will hunt down "traitors". What this means is, creating an internal
control system, similar to an Audit, that will make sure VMRO politicians
and officials do not overstep their boundaries.
Martin Protugjer will be the head of all the 'threes'. These (trojki) go
back to the historical foundations of VMRO, which back then was the only party
i.e. revolutionary organization that couldn't be penetrated by spies or traitors.
It will be the same model, however, with a different modern perspective and will
be used to control their own officials. The goal is, no party official can become
a 'local sheriff' and do whatever he or she wishes. VMRO's people in charge say "The
'threes' will make sure our (VMRO) Officials at no point forget who elected them
to office. The Macedonian citizens are our bosses and we report to them."
- Corruption will not be allowed. If one member of VMRO is corrupt, that
individual ruins the image for all of VMRO. That individual would be considered
a 'modern traitor' and the "threes" will hunt them down. "Threes" will
be set up everywhere around the country, that will make sure only honesty, professionalism
and respectability is practiced by VMRO's officials.
You don't see this too often, a party, in the Balkans from all places,
to make sure they don't steal or use their political power! Our correspondent
says, similar internal control system for political parties exists in Denmark
and Norway, who for decades are voted the least corrupt countries in the world.
Challenging
Whose Identity?
By Bushav
24th July 2008
The challenge which the Hellenic Republic initiated
over the name of the Republic of Macedonia and the Macedonian identity
has again become a hot topic, and in light of recent events such as the
Greek veto of Macedonia's entry to NATO it is worth delving deeper into
the problem.
The basis of Greece's challenge to the distinct Macedonian identity is
that a country called Republic of Macedonia naturally implies territorial ambitions
on all other regions also called Macedonia, including the three peripheries in
Greece. Two cases can immediately disprove this logic, such as the state of Luxembourg
not having territorial ambitions over the French region of Luxembourg despite
having the same name. Kosovo is an opposite example, where the entity obviously
has a different name to Albania, yet it was annexed from Serbia under an irredentist/separatist
policy. It is clear that having the same name for a republic and a region has
little to do with irredentism or separatism. It has more to do with the national
psyche of the people, and Greece has very little to worry about with regards
to the ethnic Macedonian psyche. Ethnic Macedonians, the only group which avoided
ethnic violence in the Yugoslav wars in the 1990s, are peaceful, realistic people
that want basic human rights. In fact, the Macedonian government has a statement
in their very constitution removing any territorial ambitions on its neighbors,
a move yet to be reciprocated.
Having just outlined Greece's only formal objection to the Republic of
Macedonia's use of the Macedonian name, it is clear that they are clasping at
straws. It is obvious that something else lies deeper below the surface of this
issue, and it can not be simply explained by mentioning the existence of the
ethnic Macedonian minority in Greece. To understand Greece's problem with the
Macedonian identity and the Macedonian minority in Greece, it is pertinent to
understand the context in which they have challenged the ethnic Macedonian identity,
the Macedonian nation and the name of the Republic of Macedonia. Let us first
understand the modern Greek national consciousness and perhaps it will shed some
light on realistic solutions to this dispute.
What does the term 'Greek' encompass and what are the implications of describing
someone as such? There are three popular applications of this term, and while
they are vastly different, they are not mutually exclusive, lending to quite
a fluid definition of what it means to call someone 'Greek'.
From the times of the Ottoman Empire, the term 'Greek' was a popular identifier
used to describe Christian orthodox people that belonged to the Orthodox Church,
the headquarters of which were in Constantinople (İstanbul). The language
used in this church was a form of Greek, in a similar way that Latin was used
in the Roman Catholic Church. The definition of 'Greek' meant that the term could
be applied to a range of Christian groups of different ethnicities, such as ethnic
Albanians, Macedonians, Turks, Vlachs and Bulgarians, so long as they were part
of the Greek Orthodox Church. After all, ethnicity was not the main identifier
at the time of the Ottoman Empire. People were identified by their religion.
The term 'Greek' was also used to identify people with relation to Hellenism.
A significant part of the European Renaissance was the discovery of the Ancient
Hellenic culture in the fields of science, mathematics, philosophy and democracy.
This civilization was and is widely regarded as the cornerstone of western civilization,
and calling someone a 'Greek' in the context of Hellenism lends not to their
ethnicity or religious affiliation, but a frame of mind and an ideology. The
term 'Hellenic' is often used synonymously with 'Greek', and it is applied to
scholars and philosophers in modern times that have no physical or blood connections
with the Balkans. This definition allows the term 'Greek' to be applied to a
variety of people spanning all ethnic groups and races across the world.
The third context in which 'Greek' is used in the modern world, is with
respect to citizenship and geographical location. 'Greek' may be used to define
anyone that is born in Greece, regardless of race, mother tongue or ethnic background.
This is common practice around the world; however it becomes uniquely interesting
when the terms 'ethnic Greek' and 'Greek by genus' become involved.
The official position of the Greek government is that Greece's ethnic profile
is 97% ethnic Greek, with a 3% Muslim minority. This is unusual, as being Muslim
alone does not change one's ethnicity. If someone is Greek and a Muslim, it does
not make them a different ethnic group. It makes them a different religious group.
Clearly it is inaccurate to use these figures in the context of ethnicity. The
Hellenic Republic seems to be either confused about what ethnicity actually is,
or it is trying to deliberately avoid the very concept of ethnicity all together.
An ethnic group is defined by common customs, mother tongue, AND genetics.
When we delve further into the fabric of Greek society, it is interesting to
discover a number of different 'types' of Greeks. 'Arvanite Greeks' speak a language
closely related to Albanian, bilingually with Greek. 'Vlach Greeks' are bilingual,
speaking a different mother tongue, closely related to Romanian and ethnic Vlachs
in the Balkan region. 'Muslim Greeks' speak a variety of non-Greek languages,
mainly Turkish, Bulgarian or Macedonian. 'Slavophone Greeks' are people who are
genetically, linguistically and culturally related to the ethnic Macedonian people
in the Republic of Macedonia and abroad. Upon further analysis of these groups,
it is evident that they are not different 'types' of ethnic Greeks, but in fact
are distinct ethnic groups within Greece.
The Hellenic Republic publishes information stating that in terms of ethnicity,
Greece is 97% Greek, 3% Muslim, however they are not representing the whole truth.
Given the fact that they further specify different types of ethnic Greeks within
that group, it is clear that these diverse 'subsets' are not in fact subsets.
They are distinct ethnic groups. It seems that we have found the source of this
confusion. If we are to understand Greece's demographics using the true definitions
of religion and ethnicity, Greece is 97% Orthodox, 3% Muslim according to religion,
and ethnically speaking, it is diverse and multi-ethnic, which is a far more
realistic explanation given the rich and diverse nature of the Balkans. To put
this into context, the Balkans is no longer Ottoman, nor is it a viable place
to apply the concept of mono ethnic 19th century-style nationalistic states.
The Balkans is a multi ethnic region which requires realistic multi ethnic states.
Unfortunately the Hellenic Republic insists on its idea of applying a 19th
century-style mono ethnic state model to their Balkan country. Upon analyzing
the past 200 years of modern Greek history, one will find a story of colonization
and nation building. The case of the ethnic Macedonians in this context begins
from the early 20th century, when Greece was granted new territories in Macedonia
after the fall of the Ottoman Empire in 1912. After 1922, Greece managed to replace
almost all Muslims in Greece's newly acquired Macedonia region with orthodox
Christians from Turkey specified by the Treaty of Lausanne. These Turkish-speaking
Christian groups were to live alongside the existing indigenous ethnic Macedonian
Christians. A process of nation building was further applied to these populations
so as to ensure that they would renounce their ethnic identity and accept a new
Greek identity, using the sole fact that they were Orthodox as justification
for the ethnocide. The legacy of this policy still exists, and it is still the
official line from Athens. There currently exists a policy where one must proclaim
that they are 'Greek by genus' to be allowed entry to their birthplace in Greece.
Anyone who doesn't remains banished from their homeland.
After having mentioned the various definitions of
a 'Greek', it truly makes one wonder what it means to be 'Greek by genus'
anyway.
It is clear that the name dispute was conceived to protect this outdated
and inaccurate definition of Greek identity, based on an idea that for a state
to work it must be mono ethnic. The ball will eventually drop that Greece is
a multi ethnic Balkan country, and that it is in fact possible to live and prosper
with such an idea. Greece can try with all her might to deny another nation the
right to exist, however she will ultimately fail because it is simply unrealistic
to erase people beyond your own borders. It is also unfair to allow Greece to
toy with the prosperity of the Republic of Macedonia, when the only realistic
solution to this silly dispute will clearly have to come from within Greece.
After all, who are the Greeks to challenge anyone's identity?
GRUEVSKI'S LETTERS
I applaud Prime Minister Nikola Gruevski for the
series of letters he sent out to various organizations, including the one
sent to Kostas Karamanlis. Though, the replies he got were downright
disgraceful!
Gruevski asked ArvanitoVlach Prime Minister Kostas Karamanlis to recognize
the ethnic Macedonian minority in ArvanitoVlachia. Karamanlis replied by saying
there is no ethnic Macedonian minority in ArvanitoVlachia!
What Mr. Karamanlis needs to realise though is that it is not up to
him to decide whether or not an ethnic Macedonian minority exists in ArvanitoVlachia.
It’s up to the people to decide for themselves!
The reply sent by the President of the European Commission, Mr. Jose' Manuel
Barroso was an absolute joke!
".....the European Union has no general competence to deal with issues
such as identities of minorities, their rights, acquisition of citizenship and
restitution of properties, arising in its Member States. This is the primary
responsibility of the Member States in light of their constitutional traditions
and international obligations....."
The above just shows what a racist shi-t-hole the EU really is!
By the way, what is the origin of this guys name?! Jo-se' > Zhe Zhivee,
Man-u-el > covek od (zhiv)e-li, Ba-rro-so > (zhi)ve-ra (i) zhe.
Nevertheless, this is just the beginning! We need to keep on fighting for
the rights of our people in the neighbouring states. Like Mr. Gruevski we all need
to "KEEP ON WRITING"! The truth needs to get out there for all to see!
By Atanas
Opinions
"NO" TO
ANY SO-CALLED NAME PROPOSALS FROM NIMETZ
It’s impossible for Macedonia to have any meaningful
discussions on issues of identity and ethnicity with the artificial
Greek state.
Without consulting Macedonian and other credible historians, the west,
under the guise of the UN, is blatantly forcing Macedonia to change its constitutional
name to suit their own interests and the interests of artificial Greece!
Alexander would be turning in his grave!
Celto-Frankish President Sarkozy "the onus is
on Skopje to compromise"! (this does not come as a surprise as Celto-France
helped create artificial Greece in 1829!). The people of Celto-France
and artificial Greece also have proto-Slavic blood in their veins,
but their governments are in denial!
Macedonia has changed its flag and constitution. Artificial Greece,
not surprisingly, has not given up anything!
The Macedonian Diaspora must do everything it can to ensure that the
citizens of the Republic of Macedonia vote "NO" to any composite name
which may be put to a referendum!
By Atanas
NEW
WORLD ORDER
The cold blooded colonial powers (France, England,
etc) chiefly comprised the former 'world body', the so-called "League
of Nations". This organization did nothing to safeguard the Macedonian
people’s human rights in what was then tri-partitioned Macedonia.
The so-called "United Nations" is the successor to the League
of Nations. This organization too is a farce and is no different from the former
League of Nations.
The Macedonian government is giving the so-called "UN" far too
much respect and legitimacy. I wonder if they realize that there is a Western
conspiracy ("The New World Order") to rule the world on their terms
through the use of the UN?!
The Macedonian government and Macedonian people better realize quickly
that Nimetz has been appointed by his superiors to change the constitutional
name of the country!
A country called "The Republic of Macedonia" is against Western
interests! Wake Up Macedonians! We must pull out of the so-called "UN" mediated
talks on our name! Now!
By Atanas
Concerns
Everyone's heard of the story of Kalesh Angja, the
woman who was sought after for a Turkish wife but instead chose to end
her life rather than becoming a Muslim wife.
Here's the song about her http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A923enCmm2U
Dnevnik has
an interesting article on the house of Kalesh Angja in Stara vina, Mariovo, southern
Macedonia. They talk about how the house is falling apart, now a home to snakes.
Apparently the last descendant of Kalesh Angja lives in Australia! This person
a few years ago sold the property to a Bitolchanec for 500 euros. Some French
organization is trying to help to restore the house.
Just thought I’d put that here because I had no clue that such a house
existed or that even a descendant exists of Kalesh Angja! I think that's cool.
By Dejance
Choices
MACEDONIA
VS CITY STATES (NOT GREECE)
Various indigenous proto-Slavic tribes constituted
'the expanding' ancient Macedonian state in the Balkans. For centuries,
they had continued to intermingle with each other and they identified
themselves as "Macedonian", before the state was conquered
and occupied by the Romans.
The same cannot be said about the ancient, independent of each other,
hybrid, proto-Slavic/Afro-Asiatic, City States which were to the south of
Mount Olympus. Intermingling with each other was only possible after they themselves
were conquered and occupied by the Romans.
We can talk of an ancient Macedonia in the Balkans before the Roman
conquest. We cannot talk of an "Ancient Greece" in the Balkans before
the Roman conquest!
Roman maps clearly show a distinction between Macedonia and what they geographically called "Achaea" (Greece)
to the south of Mount Olympus!!!
To highlight the point: Ancient Macedonia was already a country before
the Roman conquest. There was no country called "Greece" before the
Roman conquest. South of Macedonia were the City States!
GO AND FOOL PEOPLE WHO DON'T KNOW!
By ZAC I -THE FIRST
Free Advice
The modern Greeks, a bitter and quickly shaken Balkan
and Anatolian cocktail, a multicultural poly lingual people who lived together
for centuries under roman and ottoman empires sharing a common religion
and living the same nationalist dream love to give lessons to other Balkan
peoples about who and what they are, still harping on in this forum, lecturing
us about our link to Macedonia.
It is so boring, having to read the same nonsensical hypocritical drivel
that masks itself as modern Hellenic history these days. The Megali idea dream
infected with the deadly dose of Metaxas fascism is your muse and framework,
yet you aspire to genuine historical scholarship, you are surely ouzo drenched
taverna jokers and bouzooki players, pretending to be in a Sophocles play.
I am kind of sorry for modern Greeks never has a small nation been so utterly
intoxicated with their national myths that they are prepared to act so willfully
and pursue relentlessly the destruction of a nation who call themselves Macedonians.
I wonder how modern history will judge this lunatic behavior, yet here we have
the flower of their patriotism, the great neo Hellenic human rights scholars
and patriots still whining on and on with “ebi veter” historical arguments and
proofs.
Let us take away the descendents of the immigrants to Macedonia of the
last hundred years and see who were the Macedonians when the bloody division
of Macedonia occurred, and in whose name the Balkan “three-amigos” tried to annex
as much of Macedonia as they could.
Let us see how the people left would declare and then respect their wishes,
and not the wishes of the envoys of great powers the corrupted politicians of
Balkan bullies and their slime ball pseudo intelligentsia.
But we know this would never happen the truth would be too destructive
for Greece and Bulgaria. Better to continue to debate history than to ask the
people of Macedonia who they are and how their nation should be called.
Whatever you may call us we will always believe ourselves to be that, which
we logically are, Macedonians. Why don’t you old Turkiyes get it, we are Macedonians.
We are not the people of Bulgaria or Greece, not Crete, not Britain or France
not China. All I wish is for your self proclaimed experts on Macedonia to afford
us the same rights they expect for themselves. The right to self determination!
By Osiris
History
History of the City of Stobi
The largest city in the northern part of the province of Macedonia in Roman times was Stobi. The Roman historian Titus Livy provides the oldest historical references to the city. These concern the period of the 2nd century B.C. and the First Macedonian War when in 197B.C. the Macedonian king Philip V defeated the Dardanians in the vicinity of Stobi in Paeonia. The same author notes that Stobi was located on the Erigon (Crna) River not far from the place where it joined the Axios (Vardar). According to Livy, Stobi was an old city (vetus urbs) in contrast to the new city of Perseis that Philip V established in 183 B.C. The same historian mentions Stobi for the third time in connection with the end of independence for the Macedonian kingdom and the division of Macedonia into merides (167 B.C.); at that time Stobi became part of the fourth meris.
The city was probably built in the Hellenistic period, during the 3rd - 2nd century B.C. at the earliest. Test trenches on the acropolis in 1971 and 2001 indicated that the earliest investigated level 'belonged precisely to that period, to the 2nd century B.C.
Archaeological finds, discovered during excavations of the site, point to an even earlier settlement in the vicinity of the city. The archaeological material suggests that habitation began around Stobi already in the Neolithic period, but became much more intense during the Iron Age, when the Paeonians can be located in these regions. Burial customs and pottery from Paeonian graves in the city point to the period from the 7th -6th to the 3rd -2nd centuries B.C. On the basis of these burials and of the buildings that follow successively above them, the pre- Roman settlements of the time of Philip V can be located on the north end of the riverine terrace at the bend of the Axios and the old channel' of the Erigon. The settlement was only 3 hectares in size, but south of it extended the necropolis or cemetery. Excavations until the present have still not defined the old Paeonian settlement.
Thus, archaeological finds from previous excavations allow a picture of pre-Roman Stobi to be outlined. It is possible to differentiate two pre-Roman settlements, a Macedonian one formed at the time of Philip V (early 2nd century BC) and of his serious interest in the northern regions after the conflict with the Dardanians, and an earlier one, from the Iron Age and the Archaic and Classical periods, which can be connected with the Paeonians, even if still only through chance finds. The investigations carried out at Stobi in the course of 80 years of the 20th century provide information that precisely confirms this hypothesis. Research on the ceramics at Stobi in the 1970s showed a quantity of local gray pottery whose beginnings could be traced as far back as the 7th century B.C. In the course of the 5th and 4th centuries, this pottery had a number of varieties, and its distribution beyond the region of Macedonia can be followed further north. At Stobi particularly characteristic finds were kantharoi, skyphoi, hydriai, jugs/pitchers, and bowls. Finds of black-glazed pottery at Stobi are few. The number of ceramic finds abruptly increases in the Hellenistic period, especially from the end of the 3rd century B.C., and the types of this pottery are numerous. Particularly characteristic for the whole region of the Vardar Valley are relief bowls with floral decoration on gray to black fabric.
The city of Stobi was located on the old Balkan traffic artery, which through the Morava and Vardar valleys, as the main highway, led from north to south from prehistory until today. The road leading from Pelagonia to Astibo (Shtip), Pautalia (Kjustendil), and Serdika (Sofia) crossed the north-south highway at Stobi.
After the late Hellenistic period, the information about the city continues with the period of the civil wars at Rome. Stobi was the sole oppidum civium Romanorum that held that rank in the period of the Late Republic among the non-Latin speaking population. The city began to expand extensively in the 1st century, in the period of the early Principate, i.e., at the time of the emperor Augustus, but its growth was particularly apparent from the time when the city received the rank of municipium. This probably occurred around the middle of the 1st century, before 69 AD, and Stobi shared this title with Koela in the Thracian Chersonese, as the only municipia in the eastern part of the Roman Empire. In addition, Stobi was the only municipium outside of Italy whose citizens had the right of the ius italicum, a privileged status that meant freedom from taxes, in particular from the important tax on land (tributum soli). The residents with Roman citizenship were enrolled in the tribes Aemilia and Tromentina.
In 69AD the mint officially began to function at Stobi. Bronze coins with the legend Municipium Stobensium were recognizable in the region. The Stobi mint worked sporadically from the time of the emperor Vespasian until the time of the emperor Elagabalus; then because of the transfer of the entire Roman military force to the Danube, to protect the borders from barbarian attacks, Viminacium, now Kostolac in Serbia, took over its role.
In the vicinity of Stobi were found significant mining resources as well as ancient quarries for marble. In addition to the documented use of local marble, metal manufacture has been noted, and coins were minted very probably from local copper.
In the course of the Early and Middle Imperial period, the city developed intensively and experienced prosperity attested to by the buildings of that period. The cosmopolitan urban life allowed the settlement of various ethnic groups scattered throughout the empire. At Stobi existed a strong Jewish community; the primary evidence for this community is the luxurious synagogue established by Polycharmos.
Meanwhile, during the Roman Empire religious life at Stobi developed apace. In the Theater a temple of Nemesis was discovered. Asklepios, Hygeia, and Telesphoros, a triad associated with healing and health, were venerated, along with Artemis Lochia, Klarian Apollo, Jupiter Liberator, Dionysos, and Hera, as well as the imperial cult.
Perhaps it appears a bit odd, that at Stobi the deities most worshipped were those of health and healing. But when one considers the evidence for epidemics of plague and the large number of graves in the investigated cemeteries, one suspects that this was the only way in which the townspeople wished to express concern for preservation of their health. Statues of Asklepios, alone or with his children Telesphoros and Hygeia, numerous terracotta figurines of Telesphoros, and statues and inscriptions dedicated to Klarian Apollo provide their contribution to the concern for the health of the inhabitants. The diseases that decimated the population of the city served as the primary motivation for the veneration of divinity.
Despite the non-Italian character of Stobi, the city was urbanized according to Roman designs. It had two main streets, the cardo maximus and the decumanus maximus, which crossed at right angles, while the remaining streets were parallel with them. This was the arrangement during the 1st to 3rd centuries, i.e., the high point of the Roman Empire. Toward the end of the 3rd century, the city was destroyed. It was rebuilt in the late 3rd and 4th centuries, when the Roman network of streets based on cardo-decumanus was abandoned.
According to the burial customs over a long period, as well as on the basis of onomastic material, a mixed ethnic structure has been identified at Stobi. This was one of the reasons why Stobi did not receive independent status as a Roman colonia but held the rank of municipium. During the Roman Empire the Roman or Italian population of Stobi was not predominant. The best evidence for this is the fact that official inscriptions were written in Latin while most of the others were in Greek.
No historical sources exist for Stobi in the Early Imperial period. On the basis of stratigraphy and the investigation of certain buildings, one may conclude that the city was completely ruined at the end of the 3rd century. This may be connected with a destruction of the city by the Goths and Herulians in 267-8 or with an earthquake in the late 3rd century.
Much more evidence, however, is available for the Late Antique period. Specifically we have information in various documents about the Christian bishops of the city, e.g., Budios who participated in the Council of Nicaea in 325. Two edicts issued at Stobi in June 388 indicate that the emperor Theodosius visited Stobi at that time.
In the 4th century, in separate buildings in the city, e.g., the House of the Fuller and the House of Parthenius, two dining rooms are observed in the houses, as a reflection of the separate living quarters of men and women. This indicates abandonment of the Roman way of life and acceptance of the characteristics of the Oriental way of life. Also, the streets of the city were narrower than the Roman ones, so that Stobi in that period resembled the cities of the East more than a Roman settlement.
Some scholars have concluded that in the late 4th century Stobi became part of the province of Macedonia Salutaris and perhaps served as its capital city. In the 5th and 6th centuries it was the capital of the newly formed province of Macedonia Secunda. With this period is connected the second cultural and economic flowering of the city; to this attest not only the architectural remains but also the name of Johannes Stobaeus, a member of the literary elite of the empire.
A major destruction of the city occurred ca. 450 AD. The investigations of the last decades uncovered Hunnish bow and arrows, which indicate that the Huns passed through these regions on their journeys of conquest to the south.
During the 5th and 6th centuries the literary sources note many sad events connected with the life of the city. Significant is the attack of the Ostrogoths on Stobi in 472, when the citizens opened the gates to Theodomir and thus saved the city from destruction, probably paying a large price for this. Very likely they supplied the Ostrogoths with provisions for their march toward Constantinople.
Stobi did not have the same good fortune in 479, when Theodoric captured the city and massacred the garrison stationed there for its defense. This, however, was not the end for the unfortunate city. In 518 occurred a serious earthquake that destroyed 24 cities in the region, very probably including Stobi. The city probably suffered another earthquake in 527, a disaster that caused Stobi to be abandoned by its population. The later renewal of the city applies only to certain important buildings. The last coins found at Stobi date to 584-5, but the city in its full urban splendor certainly ceased to exist in the 6th century.
The city continued to be the seat of a bishop throughout the 6th century; according to historical sources, Bishop Phocas of Stobi participated in the Council of Constantinople in 553. Two other bishops are mentioned during the 7th century, even if it is clear that the city was not so prosperous as to be an episcopal seat, and maybe no one lived there at all.
The bishops who participated in the Councils at Constantinople in 680 and Trullo in 692 were probably bishops of Stobi only on paper. Nevertheless, according to some evidence from the 7th century, with the settlement of the Semersianoi in the region of Macedonia, the bishopric of Stobi was revived.
The last mention of the city would seem to indicate that Stobi continued to exist until the 11th century. According to it, in 1014 the Byzantine emperor Basil II destroyed a military garrison at the city, although it probably refers to a fortified place without an urban settlement. Nevertheless, on the basis of archaeological discoveries, we can point to some traces of settlement in the course of the 11th century on the territory of Stobi.
Source: Dr. Eleonora Petrova, “Stobi”, Skopje, Museum of Macedonia, 2007
Translated by Dr. Carolyn Snively
To be continued
Stories
BLACK
MAN & BLACK DEITIES
FIRST MAN ENTERS EUROPE VIA (WHAT IS TODAY) "BULGARIA".
The earliest traces of human existence were found
in Africa and dated 3-4 million years ago. About 2 million years ago the
process of migration from Africa to other continents began.
There is a theory that primitive man might have entered the European continent
via the Hellespont, route to "Bulgaria", then the Balkan Peninsula.
And what is more, from there they had probably continued their journey towards
Western Europe, to the west, and China and India, to the east.
According to the Bulgarian prehistory experts, there has been uncontestable
evidence approved by the international scientific community that humans had existed
in the "Bulgarian" lands 1 million 600 thousand years ago, and probably
earlier than that!
Proof of this statement are the flint tools, the stone tools, and the bone
tools dug out. The primitive men were a variety of the 'Homo erectus' or 'Homo
ergaster' species. The latter two are the first known species in the evolution
of the 'Homo genus'.
According to Nikolay Sirakov from the Bulgarian Academy of Science, the
cave in the Belogradchik area, Northwestern Bulgaria even bore remains of the
Neanderthal species.
In this "Bulgarian" cave archaeologists have unearthed a succession
of hunting camps lying on top of one another, the earliest reaching 9.5 metres
below the current floor of the cave. In evolutionary terms the top layer
takes us 40,000 years back, when the first modern man, called 'Homo Sapiens'
(from Latin 'wise man' or 'knowing man') originated. From the point of view
of anatomy, physiology and neurology they looked no different from us. They
even had the same intellectual capacity, and the same skills and abilities.
NEANDERTHALS
The Neanderthals probably had a religious sense, but they were probably
without organized religion. We know that they sometimes buried their dead, along
with accouterments of the living, albeit crude ones. We also know that sometimes,
they merely left their dead in piles and heaps of bones.
Think about it. What is there, that is universal to the human species,
across all known time and space? What is it, which helps to organize greater
groups of people into more efficient sound organisms except religion? Man
invented religion, and religion molded man. (Neanderthals did live alongside
Homo Sapiens for a while). With it, Homo Sapien was simply better organized than
Neanderthal, who became extinct.
WAS RUSSIA THE FIRST HOME OF MODERN MAN IN EUROPE?
A Stone Age archaeological site on the banks of the river Don in southern
Russia has been identified by scientists as the earliest known settlement of
modern humans in Europe. The discovery has provided support for the idea that
the first migration of modern humans out of sub-Saharan Africa occurred less
than 50,000 years ago.
Scientists have dated the artifacts from the Russian site to 45,000 BC,
which would make the inhabitants the earliest known ancestors of Europeans today.
"It is one of the last places we would have expected people from Africa
to occupy first", added Dr Hoffecker, who worked on the site with colleagues
from the Russian Academy of Sciences in St.Petersburg.
The discovery suggests that modern humans left Africa less than 50,000
years ago on a migration push that lead them east to Asia and north to Europe.
Reply: Modern day Macedonians (along with other "white" peoples
of Europe) are the descendants of 'these' particular "Russian" and "Bulgarian" sub-Saharan
immigrants!
This particular wave of sub-Saharan immigrants would have brought with
them the African deities, which in turn became 'Macedonian' and 'European' deities!
Rhea, the Supreme mother goddess, and the mother of Zeus, would have initially
been an African deity.
Remember, sometime after 1,600 BC there was another wave of sub-Saharan/Afro-Asiatic
colonists to Morea and the Aegean islands!
The expanding ancient Macedonian state began in 825 BC and was comprised
of "indigenous" (white man) tribes. They already knew about the
African gods from 45,000 - 40,000 BC!
PART 2: The Falcon God Horus & The "Son" of Ra
The predynistic period of Egypt (from at least 5,000
bc? to 3,000 bc) was a time when the gods ruled on earth...,The earliest
rulers were the 'anonymous' "Followers of Horus" (the falcon-god)...,
Initially the king was seen as the earthly incarnation of the falcon-god
Horus..., from the 4th dynasty (2 ,575 bc - 2,465 bc) onwards the title "Son
of Re" appears, proclaiming the king as the son rather than the incarnation
of the sun-god. -The king is seen as being his divine father’s junior".
Reply: It would appear that the ancient Egyptians perceived the sun-god
Ra to be in the form of a falcon (Horus).
-The Egyptians did not have the 'l' consonant. Horus > 'Holus' > Ho-lus > Zh(iv)i-li
= the 'life giving' sun-god 'Iliy'.
Ra/Ar = La/Al > 'Alieu'/Iliy. Note the falcon/eagle ('orel' in Macedonian)
in Oliver Stone's film 'Alexander'.
The ancient Macedonians also perceived the sun-god 'Alieu'/Iliy in the
form of a (golden) lion. Note the lion in Alexander's helmet.
Alexander > 'Ale' (the sun god)-ksan (zeus, his son?)-dar (gift). Lion > 'Ili'-on > 'Leo'.
-The Old Kingdom began with the 3rd dynasty (about 2,640 bc to 2,575 bc)
and already the second ruler of this period, "Djoser" had built
a magnificent funerary complex in stone, including the famous step-pyramid
at Saqqara.
Reply: "Djos" (son of) "er" > Zeus (son of)
ra! (Hmmm. I thought the title 'Son of Ra' appeared from the 4th dynasty
onwards!).
Pyramid > Py-ra - mi-d > (zhi)Vi-ra - ma(ke)-d(io)!!! Translation:
the 'life giving' Sun god 'Ra' & the 'mother' of 'Zeus'.
-The following quote is from the weekly newspaper 'Macedonian Sun'; Republic
of Macedonia, 1997.
Vasil Ilyov: "On one ceramic plate which is 3,500 years old (from approx
2,500 bc), Zet (ruler) Pir Macedon is mentioned. That means Macedon is the
adjective from the substantive noun Macedonia".
Reply: Pir > (zhi)Vi-r(a), Macedon > Majka (na) zhe. See Pyramid
translation!
Zet (ruler) therefore comes from the term 'Zeus', "son" of Ra.
-It is said that the ancient state of Macedonia "began" in 825
bc! Mythologically, 'Macedon' himself is a pre-Christian, religious
deity (said to be the elder son of Zeus and Tira)!
-The 4th dynasty (2,575 bc - 2,465 bc) is the age of the great pyramid builders
-Snefru, Khufu (Cheops), Khafra (Chephren) and Men-kau-re (Mycerinus).The
4th dynasty saw a rise in the prominence of the sun-god Re, with the king
adopting the title "Son of Re", and the successors of Khufu often
including the name of Re in their names".
Reply: Wasn't 'Zeus' (not the king) the original "Son of Ra"?!
Consider the following:
Khafra (Chephren) > Khaf-ra/Cheph-re(n) > Khaf (son of) ra/Cheph (son
of) re(n).
Menkaure (Mycerinus) > "My-ce-ri(nus)" > My-ce/Majka na zhe, (zhe,
sin na) ri. (It appears that the real Mycenaeans were proto-Slavs).
There too was an ancient Macedonian king called Orestes who was on the throne
around 399 bc.
Ore-ste(s) > "(H)o-re" (father of) ste/zeus.
-"The 'prophecy of Neferti' -a text fictitiously set in the 4th dynasty
in the time of Snefru, purports to record a prophecy that, after a period
of chaos, the "Son of a woman of Nubia" (Ethiopia) called Ameni
would become king and bring stability back to the land. This was to
usher in the classical period in Egypt's history. Amenemhet I ruled Egypt
from 1,991 bc to 1.962 bc. (Around this time there lived a provincial govenor
called Djehutihotep of el-Bersheh...".
Reply: Neferti > "Na -(zhi)ve-r(a) -i- di" > "Of
the life giving ra and zeus". ('Nefertiti' was a later queen
of pharaoh Akhenaten. Akhenaten reigned from 1,353 bc to 1,338 bc. He was
the father of Ankhesenamun, Queen Scota. The Egyptian symbol of life is called
the 'ankh'. Only kings, queens and gods were allowed to carry it. Interestingly,
it has the appearance of a cross which looks like a key. It was believed
that whoever was holding the ankh had the power to give life, or take
it away from others).
Amenemhet > Amene/Amun(Ra), m-he/m(ajka)-zhe/mother-zeus.
Djehuti(hotep) > Dje-huti > Zh(iv)e-zhe/Lives zeus.
hotep > 'soter' (as in Ptolemy I -Soter) > Sot-er > Zeus (son
of) ra. "Lives zeus, Zeus (son of) ra".
Bersheh > Be-r-she > (zhi)Ve-r(a) (tatko na) zhe.
-"In the reign of Sesostris III of the 12th dynasty (1,878 bc to 1,841
bc)".
Reply: Sesostris > Se-sost-ri(s) > 'Zh(iv)e-zhos (sin na) ri' > 'Lives
zeus (son of) ra'.
-"...the immediate successors of Tutankhamun, Ay (Gaedel) and Horemheb,
were both army commanders...".
Reply: Horemheb > Ho-re/Zh(iv)i-ra, m-he/m(ajka)-zhe.
By Sash
PROTO CRETANS (PHILLISTINES) AND THEIR RELIGION
The oldest signs of inhabitants on Crete are ceramic
Neolithic remains that date to approximately 7,000 BC.
The term "Minoan" was coined by the British archeologist Sir Arthur
Evans after the mythic "king" Minos. What the Minoans called themselves
is unknown. It has sometimes been argued that the Egyptian place name "Kefitiu" and
the Semitic "Kaftor" and "Kaptara" in the Mari archives
apparently refer to the island of Crete.
.Early Minoan Civilization (2,500 BC - 2,100 BC)
.Middle Minoan (2,100 - 1,700 BC)
.Late Minoan (1,700 BC - *1450 BC)
Minoan men wore loincloths and kilts (Scota and Gaedel ring a bell?). Women
wore robes that had short sleeves and layered flounced skirts.
Both Early and Middle Minoan periods were entirely matrilineal. There was
no male deity (hmmm?! something comes to mind! "Make-don-ija" > "Mother-goddess-state").
In all artifacts and archaeological digs of these two time frames, the Palace
erected for the Minoan goddess is the central feature of their entire civilization.
The goddess is represented with animals, with birds, with snakes, with
baetylic pillars (sacred stones), with sacred trees, with poppies and with lillies,
etc, etc.
The "two" theories behind the goddess is that either this was
a monotheistic society, with only one deity, the goddess who ruled over everything.
Or each time the goddess was depicted in rule over different things, then it
was a different goddess, and the society was polytheistic, worshipping goddesses
only.
In the late Minoan period we see the first appearances of her male counterpart,
a male deity. Thereafter, a "new" type of festival emerged, that
of the solar bull (the new male god) and the lunar cow (the female goddess).
It is a sexual festival where both the men and women dance, wearing bull and
cow masks. It is believed that from this evolved the early Zeus and Hera
mythology. Hera was originally a cow goddess. Zeus was the sun disguised as a
bull or a solar bull.
Minoan archaeology points to the "cave peoples" as the predecessors
of the Minoans or their mother cult. Rhea, the mountain Paleolithic cave people's
goddess (sculptured in pregnant figurines) is seen as the mother of Zeus and
Hera.
-"Paleolithic Cave Peoples"
Painted on the walls of caves in Europe Paleolithic peoples illustrated
their sexuality. Sex rites are illustrated by masked human couples at Les Combarelles
showing people engaged in sex. In the upper Gravettian caves, they created statuettes
of women found all over the caves, usually displayed as pregnant. There are a
few statutes of men, but nearly all statuettes found are of women. The masks
depicted on the walls generally tended to be cows and bulls.
In later mythology and history, these cave peoples were called the mountain
peoples of Rhea, mountain goddess, (pregnant figurines = Rhea), and mother of
Zeus and Hera. It is also believed that the Minoans came from these cave peoples
as the cult artifacts suggest in the caves of Psychro and Kamares. The pregnant
figurines also became the primary deity of the Minoans.
-Many religious and cultural scholars now believe that almost all religions
began as matriarchal religions, even the Hebrew religion (where Yahweh is
frequently referred to as physically female), but adopted patriarchal models
in later incarnations.
What precipitated the transition from goddess religions to god religions
is still subject to much debate and controversy, but the adoption of a sedentary
lifestyle because of agriculture may have fundamentally reoriented society towards
patriarchal organisation and the subsequent rethinking of goddess religions.
The Minoan religious world apparently had numerous demons as well, who
are always pictured as performing some religious ritual or another, so their
exact nature is difficult to assess. They are always depicted as human beings
with the hands and feet of a lion. While they are certainly monstrous, they may,
in fact, be symbols of religious worship.
Links:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/minoan_civilization
www.bigeye.com/sexeducation/minoans.html
www.wsu.edu/~dee/MINOA/RELIGION.HTM
My Opinion: Pre 1,600 BC.
All the indigenous, genetically related tribes of people who lived around
the southern Balkans, including the peoples of the southern Italic peninsula,
(before the Sub-Saharan/Afro-Asiatic invasion of the Morea, Peleponessus), were "Mother
Goddess" believers.
zeus = dio > do, female gender zeus = donna & zeus = zhe > ce,
female gender zeus = cenna.
1. North of Mt.Olympus > "Make-Donna" believers.
2. Morea > "My-Cenna" believers.
3. Southern Italic Peninsula > "Ma-Donna" believers.
The "real" Mycenaeans were indigenous (proto-Slav) Pelasgians.
My-Cenna is a dialect pronunciation of Make-Donna.
The Sub-Saharan/Afro-Asiatic colonists arrived at Morea (and Mycenna) sometime
after 1,600 bc. They ultimately assimilated with the locals. They did
not penetrate north beyond Mt. Olympus.
North of Mt. Olympus, in 825 bc the early and expanding "Mother-Goddess-State" ("Make-don-ija") began.
They were a select group of united, indigenous, proto-Slavic tribes.
By Sash
THE
CHOSEN PEOPLE
As well as forming the first part of the Christian
Bible, the Old Testament is also the sacred book of the Jewish people.
The first five books of the Old Testament are traditionally accepted to
have come from a great prophet called Moses, who wrote down the words of "God" (approx
1,400 BC).
Moses’ books tell the story of the creation of the world (approx 4,000
BC) and how "God" chose Abraham to be the father of the Jewish
people.
The story of Adam and Eve's temptation in the Garden of Eden (in Mesopotamia) tells
of the first sin in the world. They were cast out of Paradise into the world.
Their two sons, Cain and Abel were the first people born into the world,
and the first people born after Adam and Eve left Eden. Cain kills his younger
brother Abel and is then told by "God" that he must wander the
world for the rest of his life as punishment.
After Cain and Abel there is the story of Noah and the mighty flood (approx
2,350 BC), which happens because the descendants of Adam and Eve have abandoned
God, and no longer live a good life. So, God decides to wipe all life from the
face of the planet. He spares only Noah and his family who have maintained their
belief in God and had tried to live their lives as God wished.
After the flood, Noah's descendants, just like the descendants of Adam
before him, have abandoned and neglected God. (Shem was the eldest son of Noah
from whom the Semites are descended. Noah's son Ham was cursed by his father
for seeing him drunk and naked. Ham's descendants became the Hamites of North
Africa). Noah died at the age of 950 years old, 350 years after the flood. He
lived long enough to see the birth of several generations of his family and watch
them spread out into different countries all over the world. Over time, some
of Noah's thousands of descendants traveled far to the east and settled on a
plain in the land of Shinar. "Let us build ourselves a city and a tower
with its top in the heavens" (tower of Babel). The problem was that the
people were always dissatisfied and wanted to build the tower higher and higher
and higher! God decided to put an end to these people’s foolish desires.
With one stroke, God shattered the people’s over-confidence. He changed the words
coming out of their mouths so that no one could communicate. Everyone found themselves
listening to their friends speaking nonsense, while they each spoke a gibberish
that no one else could understand. To add to everyone's annoyance, no building
could be done. It was impossible for the architects to give instructions, the
builders couldn't call to their workmates, and they were forced to down tools.
Eventually, the people gave up trying to talk to each other in frustration. They
drifted away from the unfinished city and went off on their own to new places.
And from that time onwards, people in different parts of the world have spoken
different languages.
Rather than destroy the world, God chooses Abraham
(approx 2200 BC) and his descendants to become his own people,
his special race on earth. (Abraham was a descendent of Shem).
The story tells how God makes an agreement, or covenant, with Abraham. If
Abraham follows God's instructions, and continues to have faith in him, Abraham's
descendants will become a great people and will one day inherit the land
of Canaan, called the Promised Land.
Abraham (born in Ur, Mesopotamia) has faith in the promise of God
and packs up his family to move to Canaan, where he settles with his family.
(Canaan is the area east of the Mediterranean, in what is modern Israel and Palestine.
The area got its name from Canaan, son of Noah, who was the ancestor of the tribes
that lived there).
Abraham's first son was Ishmael by his wife Sarah's maid Hagar (approx
2100 BC). The Arabs are said to be Ishmael's descendants.
God's covenant with Abraham is re-established with his descendants, we
see the birth of his second son Isaac by Sarah, and his grandson Jacob (approx
2,000 BC). Jacob fathers twelve sons who eventually become the forefathers of
the twelve tribes of Israel.
One son, Joseph, is sold by his brothers and taken to Egypt. The Israelites
400 years of exile, as God told Abraham would happen, begins with Joseph's arrival
in Egypt. Jacob and his family also end up in Egypt (approx 1,900 BC) to
escape a terrible famine, and while they are living there, firstly as free
people but later as slaves, their numbers multiply.
(Extracts are from a simplified version of The Old Testament)
My Opinion:
Could it be that Moses and the Hebrews were liars?
Could it be that they wanted to make "their" (male) God / religion
superior than that of other peoples?
By Ljupco
The Hyksos-Israelites (Scota and Gaedel -part 7)
Ellis: "...The Hyksos-Israelites were originally
supposed to have been immigrants to (Lower) Egypt (possible exodus to Egypt
around 1,800 BC)...I am not sure if this is precisely so; however, it does
appear that though the Hyksos adopted a vast majority of Egyptian customs
(Hebrew appears to be a complete derivative of the Egyptian language),
they were also regarded as being distinctly separate from Egyptian culture...".
There have been no Egyptian hieroglyphs discovered in Ireland, Scotland,
Spain, and the surrounding islands.
Ellis: "Aye-Gaythelos was related to the Hyksos-Israelites, and so
an alternative language and script that may have influenced him is Hebrew itself. This
language was most certainly based upon the Egyptian language, so it is more than
likely that Aye-Gaythelos spoke a Paleo-Hebrew language as well as pure Egyptian
-Hieroglyphics was the writing system employed in (Thebes) Upper Egypt. The Minoans
also originally used a form of hieroglyphics for a while. There are three
main stages in the development of the Minoan script, and although the dates
of these stages are far from certain, they appear to mimic the major periods
of civic unrest in Egypt. The first stage, as mentioned, is notable for the usage
of pictorial symbols, which represents the simplest form of writing possible.
It is presumed that these glyphs and symbols (used from at least the 3rd millennium
BC up until about 1,650 BC) have meaning, but none have as yet been deciphered.
Could Minoan have been a derivative of the ancient
Egyptian language?
-The Egyptians worshiped many gods of their own. Apis the Bull was an
Egyptian god. In Egypt, the bull or calf was a symbol of fertility and strength.
The Egyptians traditionally believed that their Pharaoh was a god, and he
expected to be treated as one.
-In 1625 BC the great volcano on the island of Thera erupted with devastating
violence. The force and fallout from this eruption were sufficient to create
the biblical plagues in Egypt, which resulted in the (first) Hyksos-Israelite
exodus. The destination of these exiles from Thera is unknown, and it is
presumed that they fled to the Minoan empire in Crete, whose society and nautical
technology were virtually identical to the Therans. No decimated population has
ever been discovered in the well-preserved ruins of Thera. However, around this
same time, in the city of Avaris in Lower Egypt, a number of Minoans begin arriving
and their distinctive artwork (along with the subject matter - that of Bull-leaping)
has been discovered in the remains of this city. Mr. Manfred Bietak led
the excavations at Avaris. "Indeed, the styles employed are more typically
Theran than Minoan, indicating that the artists came from Thera (Santorini)".
The colours used in these paintings are also interesting, as the bull-leapers
skins are invariably depicted in lighter tones, which range from yellow through
to white. It is not entirely clear if these skin-tones represent a fashion or
genuinely fair-skinned people. In the tomb of Userhat, a royal scribe who worked
under Amenhotep II and was buried at Thebes, many of the people in the wall scenes
are depicted as having blonde hair. This is not simply artistic license, as some
of the people in these scenes have black hair. So, was this a new fashion for
light coloured wigs or were there pockets of other nationalities living and working
among the general population?
-The classical date for the destruction of the Hyksos capital of Avaris
by Ahmose I (of Upper Egypt) is around 1580 BC. Thus, the exiles from Thera could
have been resident in Avaris for some 40 or so years before the city was overrun
by the forces of Ahmose I. Forty years would have been quite sufficient for the
exiled royalty of Thera to have created their palace in Avaris, and decorated
it with scenes that reminded them of their abandoned and destroyed homeland.
So, to be more precise, these were not 'anomalous' Minoan frescos in Avaris,
but Theran-Minoan artwork which was created by the refugees from the island itself.
-It would seem to be perfectly obvious that a substantial number of the
Theran population must have been evacuated to Lower Egypt, where they reconstructed
a palace full of classical Theran artwork. But this flowing naturalistic style
of artwork was so different to the formal religious artwork of Egypt that it
was probably considered revolutionary. Lyvia Morgan: "Excavations conducted
by the Australian Institute...at Avaris, have now revealed thousands of fragments
of wall-painting apparently stripped from the walls of the Hyksos palace when
it was overthrown by (Ahmose I) who founded the eighteenth dynasty...".
-In fact, this naturalistic artwork was so progressive that it was to greatly
influence a later pharaoh from Lower Egypt and thereby cause a complete religious
reformation within Egypt. The later pharaoh was the revolutionary iconoclast,
Akhenaton -the father of Ankhesenamun-Scota.
-The reason for some of the Theran exiles sitting their new colony in Egypt,
rather than Crete, is uncertain. It is known that the Hyksos retained close links
with the Minoans, as many artifacts from Egypt have been discovered in Crete
and vice versa. These date from about 2000 BC, which demonstrates that there
were close contacts between the two cultures long before the Thera eruption in
1625 BC.
It is thought by many historians, including the venerable Manetho, that
the Hyksos people were a Semitic people who migrated into Egypt from the lands
to the east; in other words, the lands that had also been occupied by the proto-Minoans.
It is not beyond the realm of possibility that the Hyksos and Minoans shared
a common heritage, if not a common ancestry.
-All of these historians are indicating that the Hyksos people of Lower
Egypt had allowed the Theran-Minoans into their country, and that they may have
even adopted some of the Minoans revolutionary artistic styles. However, when
Ahmose I captured Avaris in about 1580 BC, both quasi-religious naturalistic
scenes of bull-worship and the naturalistic scenes of the Nile Delta wildlife
were hacked off the walls and destroyed. Clearly, the Theran-Minoans were far
more closely allied to the Hyksos-Israelites in Lower Egypt than they were
to the Upper Egypt regime of Ahmose I.
Reference: 'Scota: Egyptian Queen of The Scots', by Ralph Ellis, Adventures
Unlimited, USA, 2006, Pages 87-93, 167, 168, 171.
(*Authors note: Recent independent DNA/Genetic experiments show that Modern
Macedonians have a relationship with the Jews and the "proto" Cretans).
By A Digest Reader
Words
Armaggedon, Makedon & London
The "proto-Slavs" (ie. Philistines, etc),
distinct from the Hebrews, could have been the first people to inhabit
the territory of Lower Egypt and the region of Canaan.
Later (from at least 7,000 bc), many of them may have crossed the Mediterranean
where they settled around the southern Balkans.
It appears that some Balkan proto-Slav tribes (some time later) even
migrated further north into Europe as well as the British Isles (i.e. Stonehenge).
This is thousands of years before the arrival of Aye-Gaedel-Dannus there at around
about 1300 bc!
Now, consider the following:
Armageddon: (a place in Israel! "Har Megiddo" in Hebrew).
Har > Ar/Ra > the Sun God, Me-gi > Mother-Goddess, ddo > d(i)o/zeus.
Makedon: (the ancient proto-Slavic state of). Ma-ke > Mother-Goddess,
don > zeus.
(*Madonna > Ma-donna > Mother of zeus/god ("Bogo"-rodica).
London: (capital of England). Lon > Iliy (Ra), don > zeus.
*Donald: Don > zeus, "ald(o)" > Iliy.
*McDonald: Mc > Ma-ke/Mother Goddess, Don > Zeus, "ald(o)" > Iliy.
By Stojan G.
IT’S ALL "GREEK" TO ME!
Who else were believers in "G(eo)-ra, i ki"?
Thracians ("Traiki"): T-ra-i-ki > T='Th'=V > "(zhi)v(e)-ra,
i ki"
The Thracians, like the Ancient Macedonians spoke the same or a similar
language!
Boris "Trajkovski" was the late president of the Republic of Macedonia!
(Hmmm... "Graiki", "Traiki"!!!)
Trojans ("Trajani"): T-ra-ja > "(zhi)v(e)-ra, (i)
zhe"
("Trajan" is a common Macedonian boys name).
Illyrians ("Illyrjani"): I-llyr-ja > "(zhiv)i-llyr, (i)
zhe"
"Ilija" too is a common Macedonian boys name.
Epiros: Epi-ro-s > "(zh)ive-ra, (i) zhe"
Dorians ("Dojrani"): Do-j-ra > "D(i)o, (i) zh(ive)-ra"
There is "Dojran" lake in the Republic of Macedonia!
"Dozh" > D(i)o-zh(ive) in Macedonian, not surpisingly,
means 'rain'!
Serbians ("Srbi"): S-r-bi > "Zh(ive)-r(a) (zhi)vee". The
'life giving' Sun god 'Ra', 'lives'.
Kosovo: ko-so-vo > "Ko-zh(ivi) (Zhi)vee" > 'Zeus', 'the living', 'lives'.
Crete ("Aeria" and "Kriti")
Aeria > e-ri > "(zhiv)e-ra"
K-ri-ti > K>G > "Zh(ive)-ra, (i) ti"
HOW ABOUT "AKRITIS' EXPLAIN TO US THE MEANING OF HIS NAME!
Cyprus ("Kyp-ro-s"): "Zhiv(e)-ra, (i) zhe" (Not
because copper was found there!)
The forum members over at the so called www.macedoniaontheweb.com have
been checkmated!
Also:
Croat ("H-r-va-t"): > "(Z)h(ive)-r(a) (zhi)ve zhe"
Bosnia > Bo-s > "(zhi)ve-zh(e)" > the 'living' 'zeus'.
Herzegovina > He-r-ze-go-vi > "(Z)h(iv)e-r(a) z(hiv)e-zhe
(zhi)ve(jat)" > the 'life giving' 'Ra', the 'living' 'zeus',
'live'.
Czech ("Chesh"): Che-sh > "Zh(iv)e-zh(e)" > the
'living zeus'.
Pol > Po-l > (zhi)Ve-l(i) > the 'life giving' 'li'.
By Bogdan T
Risto,
About the name of the village Arachinovo. "Ara" is a typical
Armenian name, but here we have "Arachin" which means "first" in
Armenian!
Edi
Book and other Reviews
Risto
Thanks again for the Digest.
I wanted to mention that Antonio Milososki's book review "About the
Hellenization of Southern (Aegean) Macedonia - A Review of 'Fields of Wheat,
Hills of Blood' by Dr Anastasia Karakasidou" is from the Life in Aegean
Macedonia section of Pollitecon Publication's web site.
See http://www.pollitecon.com/html/life/hellenization_of_aegean_macedonia.html
A link or acknowledgment would be great.
Also with the article: Tashko Georgievski's Return By Mateja Matevski. This
essay is part of Pollitecon's translation of Black Seed published in 1995.
The article was also published in The Macedonian P.E.N. Review, Summer 2004.
Republishing without sources can be risky. Putting sources to stories and
articles including reprints adds to credibility and professionalism and helps
everyone.
Regards
Victor
Poetry
Три чеда мајка имаше
Три чеда мајка имаше.
Растеа, се радуваа.
На гради топли мајчински.
Ангели три македонски.
ЕГЕЈ тој Бисер Балкански.
И ПИРИН наш Македонски.
Не молчи Вардар жубори.
Ќе дојде ден ќе прозбори.
Ова е грутка таткова.
Света е земја Исконска.
Делена и разделена,
Наша е еј, Македонска!
Ќе кренат глава Пиринци,
И браќа наши Егејци.
Колку ли солзи сронија,
ЕДНА Е МАКЕДОНИЈА!
Posted by Dracevec
ONLY GOD CAN CHANGE THE NAME
The sun did shine
upon our land
The GOD of the sun called it MACEDON
AND ONLY HE CAN CHANGE THE NAME
Those who try will burn
BE PROUD CHILDREN OF MACEDON
do not sell yourselves!
The Poet
WORKING
KNIGHTS
As the sun sets the sky darkens
Which means its another day
Its time to get ready for work
I drag myself from the bed to the shower
Today I think I may have the flu
After my shower I get dressed for work
I put on my house coat.
I head downstairs to get the evening paper
Then it’s quickly back to the office.
I lay on my desk and begin to read.
I see words and flip pages, but nothing.
It’s the same story again today, and it’s overcast
I put down the paper and turn on the tv and radio.
My desk has been messy for three years,
Too weak to tidy it up.
I call the doctor, but again no answer.
Haven't been able to reach him in years
Maybe he retired, moved or died
I need to get a coffee and cigarette so I go outside to my car
Once I finish I go back inside to my office.
It’s almost time for lunch but I must have forgot it at home -
it’s ok - not that hungry today.
I go sit on my desk
Feeling weak but I have work that must be done.
I have to finish my work.
It's another busy day.
It seems like I just got to work yet the sun begins to rise
I log off my computer and say, "God I hope it's better when I awake."
We're People - Working knights.
-Alex Gulin-
PS - Working Knight? People who fight depression!
From the Archives
Tashko Georgievski- Biography and Bibliography
1935-1946
To his mother Tina and his father Aleksandar, Tashko was born in the family Corgovski in March or April 1935, in the spring before Easter. Tina said a prayer for him on Easter Sunday itself. It is known that while Tina was still breastfeeding, the grandfather made a deal with a builder to build a new house. (The house was lived in for 11 years before the Monarcho-fascists burnt it down in 1946.) In that house the boy Tashko began to walk and his first recollections are from there: the front half of the house built first later went to his paternal uncle Risto (Sarbija), the lunches and dinners on the balcony where they set two tables (a big one for the grown-ups and a small one for the little ones). The first recollection was of summer. In that recollection there is also a rolling down on his uncle's stairs all the way to the porch and a wooden board placed on the beams of their part of the house along which you could pass into the one room that was made in their part of the house. That room remains in him forever because in it grandfather Goni and grandmother Jana slept on sofas, it was always full of aromas and smells of cooking and yeasty bread and cheese (there was nothing more delicious than sweet and as yet unfiltered cheese from which secretly you lifted the cloth and with a wooden spoon took a spoonful directly from the bucket), and, because in it, next to the blackened hearth with entire logs, he heard the stories told by the sweet voice of grandfather Goni. They were the first references to the world beyond the yard and the garden. With these recollections also stands the time when the thin, tall, bony boy with just a tunic draped over his body jumps over the fence of the garden and goes down into the river with the big maple, to the nearby cherry orchards, to the threshing floor with rocky earth on which they tied the horses to the pivot and chased them to turn and to mill the yellow wheat. Over there were the cousins and his big brothers and sisters, and the children from the neighbourhood, the games with wooden horses made from blackish mulberry cuttings, and a lamb or two, some goats, some cats, and some small and spotted puppies (after a bite from one of those they took him to Gorno Rodivo to have something burnt under his tongue to prevent rabies). And already it is not just one season but rather autumn is coming with distilling of rakija in the village still, and winter with snow and slipping. Arid strangely and incomprehensibly the seasons mix and change: spring, grazing the oxen, goats in flocks pass along the rocky- earth and ring with their bells. Already it is not just the gardens and the orchards that are around, rather also the landscape over the big mountains which surround the village -from the village is a view of the whole of the Meglen region below, while above the village are the secret green forests of Kajmakchalan. The time comes for school, his sisters wash behind his ears and his neck, while his father gives him a piece of firewood for heating which he has to take to school as do all of the other children every day. He does not manage to learn either alpha or omega and the school stops operating because the war starts (first the Second World War and then the Greek Civil War). Instead of reading and writing he learns the alphabet of village life: the plough and sowing, carrying wood into the town to sell for enough to buy some white bread, helping out his older brother with the goats, hiding in the mountains with the hope that he would see a wolf but with fear in his little heart lest he should really see one. The war first appears in the village as a child's game with wooden guns and with bombs made with cans and un-burnt fuses taken from the bread ovens. But after that there are also real events: the German army passes through, real battles take place between the partisans and the Germans in the village, partisan leaders pass through their house, real war exercises of the Macedonian brigade which later goes off somewhere.
Together with other children, he and his sisters join the forced departure to Yugoslavia one rainy and foggy night, carried by time and taking the image of Mirka Ginova (who had stayed in their house and slept the night in one bed with his sisters). He is propelled by the day in July when running gunfire was heard from the thick forest below the village while he had been carrying sheaves from the Padamica and the running fire had caught Mirka Ginova. They left the same year, in autumn. While his mother was in prison, his big brother in Bitola, the middle brother with the goats, his father an illegal immigrant, with one other family he goes over Kajmakchalan with his sisters and reaches liberated Macedonia -Vardar Macedonia. Starovina is the first place on this side.
1946-52
From then on he shares the destiny of all of the refugees from Aegean Macedonia: they have the hospitality and the open hearts of the liberated Macedonians -but they would have something entirely different if they were to return sometime to their hearths. The village Dolneni, the town Prilep, the train and the winter which took them north, the village Gakovo close to Sombor, on the very border with Hungary, then Skopje -that is the path of most of the refugees and his path from 1946 to 1952. If the place and the time in the village Kroncelovo was mother's milk, Gakovo and the flat land of Vojvodina are the realization that, whenever it may be, they have to return to the winds of their grandfathers. After finishing junior high school, even before the refugee settlement at Gakovo was dispersed, the train took him to Skopje. His intention was to become a teacher, but instead he continued his studies at the high school at Cvetan Dimov High School. Gakovo was Aegean Macedonia in miniature -it had people from Solun, Voden, Lerin, Kostur, Drama, Kavala, it had people from every field and from every mountain, from every valley and little lake, and it had people from our Macedonian sea, too. In 1952 they began to return to Macedonia. As they were in one Macedonia, then they were close also to the second and third.
1952 -1956
His entry to Skopje through the great railway station is, at the same time, his entry to Macedonian literature. He does not wait long for his first published work. That happened in 1952 in "Voice of the Aegeans" and in "Young Fighter". But the years passed in the boys-only high school, Cvetan Dirnov, keeping company with books and sleepless flights in narrow and cold rooms where the birth of the writer was taking place, where his story identified with the numerous stories of the refugees which were settling bit by bit into the white pages of the note books. All of those characters and worlds remained in the questions of his archive, but they also opened the path for "We Above the Embankment" and for the other books which followed.
1956 –
The following details are also part of his biography: he matriculated in 1956 and the same year he enrolled in the philosophy faculty (Yugoslav language group), the publisher "Kocho Racin" published his collection of stories "We Above the Embankment" for which he won the Kocho Racin Award; in 1959 he married Neda Minkova, the second daughter of Marija Minkova of Lugunci, Aegean Macedonia. Their first child was born in 1960 when he published his first novel "People and Wolves". In 1962 followed the novel "Walls" for which he won the award "11 October", and in 1963 a daughter was born (at that same time he served his military service of six months in the infantry school for reserve officers in Bilekja and six months service in the town Ivo Andrik- Travnik). In 1964 after returning from the army he published the collection of stories "Dry Winds", in 1966 he published the novel "Black Seed" for which he won the award "13 November" from the City of Skopje, and in 1967 his second son was born. After that there are only books: 1969 the novel "Snake Wind", 1975 "The Red Horse" (which won two awards: "Stole Popov" and "Kocho Racin"), 1978 the novel "Time for Quiet" (for which he won the Racin Recognition Award) and the collection of stories "House under the Fortress" and in 1980 the novel "Flat Land ". In 1988 came the journal "Record of Life" and in 1992 the autobiographical novel "Kajmakchalan". Georgievski has also written 5 radio dramas ("Fires", "Ashes From My Hearth", "Land of Hristos", "Return of Boris Tushev", "Chest with the Heart of Father"), more series for children, television films and documentary films as well as screen plays for feature films (Momento, Black Seed, The Red Horse, The Yellow Rose). Some of his novels have been translated into Russian, German, Hungarian, French as well as Serbo-Croatian and Slovenian. This edition of "Black Seed" is the first translation into English.
Source:
Georgievski, Tashko, “Black Seed”, Five Dock NSW, Politicon Publications, 1996. Translated by Elizabeth Kolupacev Stewart
The End
Feedback
RE: Were Macedonians Greeks?! -last issue
Reply: Almost all religions began as matriarchal religions but later, individually,
adapted to patriarchal models.
Rhea (Zhivi Rhea), the Supreme mother goddess, wife of Kronus ('K(o)ronus'/Zhivi
Ra) and the mother of Zeus, initially would have been an African (sub-Saharan)
deity.
Before the sub-Saharan/Afro-Asiatic invasion of "Morea" and the
subsequent assimilation of the peoples there (sometime after 1600 BC), all the
indigenous, genetically related tribes of "white" peoples who
lived around the "southern Balkans area" were themselves descendants
from earlier sub-Saharan immigrants dating from around 45,000 BC! They already
knew about the African deities from 45,000 BC! (Ironically, this new wave of
sub-Saharan/Afro-Asiatic colonists also knew about the same deities! They also
spoke a different language than that of the locals at Morea!).
I want to talk first about the mythology of the tribes of indigenous
white peoples of the southern Balkan Peninsula before the sub-Saharan/Afro-Asiatic
invasion and colonization of Morea which probably occurred sometime between
1,600 BC and 1,450 BC.
Rhea is the mother of Zeus (the solar bull) and Hera (the solar cow).
South of Mt. Olympus, Rhea would have been known as "Micra" and "Mycenna".
Mic-ra > Mother Rhea, My-cenna > Mother of Zeus.
North of Mt. Olympus, Rhea was known as "Mara" and "Makedonna".
Ma-ra > Mother Rhea, Make-donna > Mother of Zeus.
(Consider the boys name "Marko" > Ma-ra (mother of) ko(s)/gos/zeus).
"Heraclea" > Hera (daughter of) Clea. C-lea > Zh(ivi)-Rhea/the
'life giving'-Rhea.
"Heracles" > Hera (daughter of) Cles. C-les > Zh(ivi)-Ra/the
'life giving'-Ra.
From Zeus and Tira (Hera) the elder son "Macedon" was born.
Zet (ruler, Zeus) "Pir Macedon" is inscribed on a 2,500 BC ceramic
plate found in the modern Republic of Macedonia.
Pi-r/"(zhi)Vi-r(a)"/the 'life giving'-'Ra', Mace-don/'Mother' of
'Zeus'.
Next to be born was "Greacus" (Giorgi?). Zeus's second son born
from his daughter Pandora.
It appears that the tribes of indigenous peoples of the southern Balkan
Peninsula initially had a matriarchal religion but later, individually, adapted
to patriarchal models. Their names; Phrygians or Brygians, Thracians,
Trojans, Pelasgians, Dorians, Lyncestians, Illyrians, etc., mean that they
believe in the 'life giving'-'Ra' and (his son) 'zeus'.
(Sloveni, Elleni and Giorgi mean the same thing and are 'dialectual', 'pre-1600
BC', 'balkan', 'patriarchal religious terms').
After 1600 BC, sub-Saharan/Afro-Asiatic invaders arrived at Morea and colonized
the neighbouring region. The sub-Saharan/Afro-Asiatic colonists did not penetrate
north beyond Mt.Olympus. The sub-Saharan/Afro-Asiatic colonists were not 'Giorgi',
but rather 'Zulu's' and/or 'Ahhijawans'! (Giorgi, Zulu, 'A(r)hhija') all basically mean
the same thing!). The sub-Saharan/Afro-Asiatic colonists obviously had a different
language and alphabet than the locals but basically had the same religious
beliefs as them and over time the two began to assimilate! By around 1,475 BC
the now somewhat "hybrid" society around the region of Morea (probably
organized into semi-independent kingdoms) began to identify themselves as "Ellines".
When the Hyksos-Israelite Aye (temporarily) took control of Morea around
1,320 BC the "peoples" there became known as 'Danaoi'.
('Da' refers to 'Zeus'. Aye was a prince/king/god, and so Zeus's/Aye's
people makes sense). We also know for a fact that they called themselves 'Xenoi'.
Xe-noi > Zeus people. (It sure does appear that they have a bad habit at changing
names and falsifying history!).
The so-called "Mycenaean" civilization (empire) based at 'Mycenae',
Ahhijawa (Morea) eventually collapsed. The collapse is commonly
attributed to the 'Dorian' invasion ("probably between 1100 BC
and 950 BC", according to "Dorian Britannica Online"), with
which it is said, along with a "civil war" throughout the "Mycenaean" empire/territories
sent the entire region "south of Mt. Olympus" into a so-called "Dark
Age" which (allegedly) lasted until 700 BC.
The Dorians, initially, would have been an 'indigenous' tribe! (see
earlier, above). A people whom had faith/belief in Zeus, Ra and "Make-donna" (Mother
of Zeus).
The Dorians began their trek south to invade, defeat and dislodge the so
called Afro-Euro "Mycenaean" empire (based at 'Mycenae', Ahhijawa)
from a "starting point" around a region that is today northeast
of the town of Bitola, in today's modern Republic of Macedonia.
They headed south through "proto-Slavic" territory, then through
so called "Mycenaean controlled" Thessaly, on to Ahhijawa
and then the southern Aegean islands.
What is certain though is that in 825 BC, to the north of Mt.Olympus, the "early" (and
expanding) state of "Makedonia" (Mother of Zeus State) began with king
Karanus. NOT THE ANCIENT STATE OF "MICRA"! NOT THE ANCIENT STATE
OF MYCENE!
King Karanus (Ka-ra > Zeus-Ra) founded the Macedonian "Argead" (Ar-geo
i di, not Ahhijawan) Royal Dynasty. From now on, a select group of indigenous "Giorgi"/"Makedonna" believing
tribes whom lived north of Mt.Olympus would simply identify themselves
as "Macedonians".
Not long after the 'early' ancient Macedonian state was formed, to the
south of Mt.Olympus, particularly around Morea (the Peleponessus), the ancient, "Afro-Euro", 'independent
of each other', "City States" began to form. Athens, Thebes, Corinth,
Sparta, etc, etc. They were basically separate countries! The people though,
religiously speaking, identified themselves as "Ellines" (because of
the mixing of the African and proto-Slav languages over time).
Interestingly, in the 8th century BC, the Romans though did in fact refer
to a "Eur-African" Boeotian tribe that had migrated to Italy as "Graecus".
Why? Perhaps there is a possibility that the "Eur-African" City State
citizens religiously identified themselves not only as "Ellines" but
also as "Graikos"!?
Remember, the indigenous "Macedonians" were religious 'Giorgi'
(ie.'Sloveni'/'Elleni') and not "Graikos" (and/or "Ellines")!
There are inscriptions which have been deciphered which also show
that the Macedonians called the City State citizens "Danaians"!
The Romans called the state of Macedonia "Macedonia". They called
the territory south of Mt.Olympus "Achaea".
'Achaea', not surpisingly, is probably a Roman name (an offshoot),
derived from the Eur-African City States own interpretation of the town
of 'Argos' at the Peloponnesus and its surrounding area.
(The Romans could have done us all a favour if they instead called
the territory south of Mt.Olympus "Micra-ea" or "Mycenna-ea".
But then again, the terms 'Micra' and 'Mycenna' are dialectal, indigenous proto-Balkan
terms!).
By Sash
MACEDONIAN OLYMPIC HISTORY
After finding out about it from the Macedonian Digest, I decided to take
a look at the bogus website www.macedoniaontheweb.com for
myself. The views expressed by the morons here really are absurd! There is one
particular article I found here which I'd like to mention.
The members of this forum were making complaints to the NBC editors because
NBC had published the following information about Macedonian Olympic history:
-Macedonia will be making its 4th appearance in the Olympic Games.
Magomed Ibragimov is the only medalist in the nation’s history. He won a
bronze medal in the 85kg/187.25 lbs freestyle wrestling division at the 2000
Sydney Games.
-Philip II, King of Macedon and father of Alexander the Great, won three
Olympic titles at the ancient Games.
REPLY: It is well known that apart from the Macedonian Kings
Alexander I and Philip II (indigenous barbarians) no other Macedonian kings
associated with the (hybrid) "Eur-African" Olympic Games!
"Ma-go"(med) > Mother (of) Zeus. "Ib-ra-gi-mo"(v) > "(Zh)iv(e)-ra,
zhe, (i) ma(ke)-(zhe)". "Lives Ra, zeus, and the mother of zeus".
By the end of the 4th day of competition at the Beijing Olympics, Artificial
Greece had won no medals! I mean, this is appalling for a country which has over
160 athletes competing in many sports!
By Atanas
E-mail(s) of the Month
A nice and short reply to your literate post which no historian would read
Just one little inquiry I would like to push forward if you could produce me publication from sixty years ago, showing me a map of the country Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia, and also the Yugoslav writing of Megas Alexandros (which does not exist) and referring to your comment about Greece being formed in the 1820’s that’s false.
Greece my friend was taken over from the Turks for 300 years and we liberated and took Greece back from them.
Greece created democracy, and was one of the first civilizations in the ancient world including Egypt. And as for the emblem the son of Vergina it is Greek for thousands of years. If you have any inquires regarding this subjects please don’t hesitate to send me back an email.
Proud Daughter of the Glorious Hellenes ;-)))
Keep writing your agitprop, it makes for very good bedtime reading. The only thing is I sometimes laugh rather than fall asleep so I shall curtail your sci-fi till the weekend.
Quotable Quotes
“The Macedonians in Greece, Bulgaria, Albania and Macedonia are the same people -- one nation. If there is any confusion it’s a consequence of a century of brutal assimilation.” (Maknews)
(MACEDONIA.....WAS.....IS......AND ALWAYS SHALL BE!
AND
MACEDONIA....ZA VEK I VEKO
MACEDONIA....FOREVER AND EVER)
By Dedo Kiro
Question/Answers for the Readers
Zdravo Mr. Stefov,
Again I would like to say that I find your writing fantastic & that you should keep up the good work, if there were more people with your knowledge & heart in Macedonia we would not have the problem of changing our name & our history would be recognized.
The reason that I am writing this message is because I was arguing with a Greek person on YouTube regarding The Bucharest Treaty 1913, & he stated that we were Bulgarian & that is why we lost Macedonia, to prove his Greekness, he forwarded me some information regarding Genetic DNA, you touched on the subject in Part 2 - Who were the Ancient People? He forwarded to me some material off the internet regarding Genetic DNA titled Mitochondrial DNA Variation of Modern Tuscans Supports the Near Eastern Origin of Etruscans, In the references I discovered something that gave me an Idea, I have attached the writing from References point 32
http://www.pubmedcentral.nih.gov/articlerender.fcgi?artid=1852723#RF28
Genetic characterization of the body attributed to the evangelist Luke.
Vernesi C, Di Benedetto G, Caramelli D, Secchieri E, Simoni L, Katti E, Malaspina P, Novelletto A, Marin VT, Barbujani G.
Department of Biology, University of Ferrara, Via Borsari 46, 44100 Ferrara, Italy.
Historical sources indicate that the evangelist Luke was born in Syria, died in Greece, and then his body was transferred to Constantinople, and from there to Padua, Italy. To understand whether there is any biological evidence supporting a Syrian origin of the Padua body traditionally attributed to Luke, or a replacement in Greece or Turkey, the mtDNA was extracted from two teeth and its control region was cloned and typed. The sequence determined in multiple clones is an uncommon variant of a set of alleles that are common in the Mediterranean region. We also collected and typed modern samples from Syria and Greece. By comparison with these population samples, and with samples from Anatolia that were already available in the literature, we could reject the hypothesis that the body belonged to a Greek, rather than a Syrian, individual. However, the probability of an origin in the area of modern Turkey was only insignificantly lower than the probability of a Syrian origin. The genetic evidence is therefore compatible with the possibility that the body comes from Syria, but also with its replacement in Constantinople.
PMID: 11606723 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]
PMCID: PMC60893
If they could do this with Evangelist Luke why can’t we insist that the remains found in Vergina of Phillip II or his son Philip Arridaeus, have the same test completed if it is possible as the remains in Vergina will be much older, this will end the Greeks claim to Macedonian history & or make us change the name, a good suggestion if the results are negative for us would be New Macedonia. I have researched the Genetic DNA a little further & have found a web site that shows the comparisons in DNA in different races in Europe, they have quite a lot of DNA information stored there, the site is http://www.yhrd.org/index.html.
I have also discovered that the late Professor Cornelis Jord Ruijgh, Professor of Ancient Greek Linguistics for the University of Amsterdam also recognized that the Macedonians spoke a different language to Greek, Some information regarding this was provided to Joana Lendering who has a web site on Macedonia & Alexander the Great without any Greek influence, after reading the ending it sounded as though the Greeks did give her some trouble, she does mention the Macedonian situation in her writing. The web site is
http://www.livius.org/maa-mam/macedonia/macedonia.html
I hope this information is helpful, I believe that we should take advantage of the technology that is available to us & hopefully it will help our situation regarding the Greek claim to all of Macedonian History & lands lost in 1913. (They could probably experiment with remains form Heraclea in Bitola to see if the test is possible also to find out if Genetic DNA is Macedonian or Greek)
Regards
Valentino Trajkovski
From the Un-answered Questions File
Humour
Doctor's Orders
A man and his wife were having problems in their relationship, so they went
to a psychologist.
The psychologist, who was a man, saw the couple several times, but to no
avail.
The woman complained her husband wasn't affectionate.
The man said he didn't understand what she was talking about.
Finally, after many sessions of explaining to the man his wife's need for
affection, the psychologist lost his patience. He told the man's wife to
take off her clothes, then the psychologist had sex with her, and told the
man, "This is what your wife needs every day".
The man frowned, thought for a moment, then said, "OK, what time do
you want me to bring her back tomorrow?"
Posted by Commander Bond
"Heaven is a place where the police are English; the chefs are Italian; the car mechanics are German; the lovers are French and it's all organized by the Swiss. Hell is a place where the police are German; the chefs are English; the car mechanics are French; the lovers are Swiss and it's all organized by the Italians."
Posted by Pesijazal
======oOo======
If you have something to say or if you want to know something, this is the forum for you. Please write to us and we will publish your thoughts in this Digest. Try and keep it simple and brief, no longer than a page. Please send your comments to Risto Stefov at rstefov@hotmail.com.
“From the readers for the readers”
A Monthly free of charge electronic Digest for fair use only
======oOo======