The Macedonian Digest
“From the readers for the readers”
Edition 35 – November 2008
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Editor’s Notes
Dear readers and friends,
Just recently I have been accepted as a full time writer/author to write for the American Chronicle (http://www.AmericanChronicle.com). You can find my articles at this link;
http://www.americanchronicle.com/viewByAuthor?authorID=3446
Regards, Risto…
Feature Stories
Macedonians Fight with Church Bells against Greek Army
http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/3784/1/
Thirty Macedonians from Ovcharani, Aegean Macedonia (Greece), for two days
protested in front of a Greek military training field near the village of Zabrdeni,
asking for the Greek Army to retreat from their region, informed local citizens.
Greek soldiers who slept in tents under the open sky were woken up late
at night from the sounds of church bells from the surrounding villages which
all rang at the same time.
Ethnic Macedonians in Greece are fed up with the Greek Army intimidation
tactics to show up with tanks surrounding their villages, under the auspices
of ‘training’. Local resident who wished to remain anonymous explained to MINA
that the Greek Army always chooses to show their might in cities and villages
where ethnic Macedonians are the majority.
-They come here, surround our villages with tanks and stay here for weeks,
sometimes months. They think we will get scared. Why don’t they do their training
in Athens? - says an ethnic Macedonian from Ovcharani who also complained of
the pollution the tanks caused to his crops.
Two nights ago, local villagers set up a four car road blockade to prevent
the Greek Army convoy from reaching their training destination. A tractor was
also added to the blockade, after which the Greek police and a public prosecutor
arrived up at the place of the incident.
Negotiations between the police and demonstrators went until midnight,
after which the Macedonians left.
Yesterday ethnic Macedonians gathered again to protest the presence of
the Greek Army and their intimidation tactics who according to local residents
never work.
Three elite units of the Greek MoI were sent to prevent the Macedonians
from entering the training ground.
MINA has no information if any arrests were made.
Rock Engravings from 32,000 BC found near Treskavets
Monastery in Macedonia
BalkanTravellers.com
http://www.balkantravellers.com/en/read/article/752
5 September 2008 | Traces of rock engravings dating back to 34,000 years
ago were found by archeologists in the area of the thirteenth-century Treskavets
Monastery near the town of Prilep in southern Macedonia., national media reported
recently.
“At the highest point near the monastery, we found traces of rock engravings.
The significance of this discovery is even biggest when it is known that this
type of rock engravings are among the oldest ones, placed by Dr, Amati of the
Swedish Rock Art Arcive in the timeframe of 32,000 years before Christ,” Dushko
Aleksovki of the Macedonia Art Centre told the Vecher newspaper.
Such engravings have been recorded in front of and behind the monastery,
Aleksovski explained, adding that, “excavations in the vicinity of the Treskavets
will continue until the material found has been completely documented.”
As BalkanTravellers.com reported a broad project was announced in July
for the protection and restoration of the thirteenth-century Treskavets monastery,
as well as its water supply system and the road network around it.
Read more about the Treskavec Monastery on BalkanTravellers.com
Read more about Macedonia on BalkanTravellers.com
Use BalkanTravellers.com's tips to organize your trip to Macedonia
Posted by TrueMacedonian
GREEK SECRET SERVICE NOT A SECRET
A document from the Greek Secret Service, dating back to
1982 has been uncovered. It exemplifies the methodical steps Athens took
to destroy Macedonian ethnic conscious as well as the “idiom” (Macedonian
language) within its territory.
The plan had been drafted on February 16, 1982, by the Chief of the Greek
Secret Service, Dimitris Kapelaris.
According to the plan, Athens had created a Secret Team nicknamed “Plot
Against Macedonia” that was dispatched to Aegean Macedonia (Greek occupied Macedonia)
and infiltrated into all aspects of public life: (Tax office, Schools, Army,
Church, etc). This is the period when a lot of Macedonians were followed, jailed,
fired, beaten, for publicly stating they were Macedonians, not realizing they
were being spied on at every level.
The Greek Secret Service also had plans for Florina (Lerin) residents who
failed to “feel Greek”, and feared may succumb under local Macedonian influence.
As a solution, the Secret Service proposed to give these people money, brainwashing
literature, and creating a cultural organization named “ARISTOTELIS”. A brilliant
plan, that ought to make them “Greek”! The magnitude, the sheer stupidity and
lunacy of these people is remarkable.
Dimitris Kapelaris took a moment to congratulate the Secret Service for
managing to ‘almost’ wipe out the Macedonian conscious and the ‘idiom’ in Kastoria
(Kostur) Region.
The Greek Secret Service despised the fact that Macedonians marry only
Macedonians in Greece, and made plans how to mix marriages, so the Macedonians
would lose their ethnicity.
Were they trying to create more of the Karamanlis type? Their plan backfired,
to this day Macedonians in Greece marry Macedonians.
The year of this letter, 1982, is also the year Athens implemented laws
banning Macedonian refugees from returning to their properties - Not a coincidence.
Without further ado, below is the complete document drafted by the Geek
Secret Service.
HELENIC REPUBLIC
Top Secret
MINISTRY OF PUBLIC SECURITY
NATIONAL SECURITY SERVICE
Athens, 16th February, 1982
Number of protocol 6502/7-3042?
INTRODUCTION
a) The Skopians’ activities for the autonomy of Macedonia may be efficiently
confronted mainly by wiping out the use of the idiom, in the regions near the
borders. This opinion is based on the realizations that also other regions that
in older times were center of “Macedonism”, like Kastoria, are now hit by the
Skopian propaganda, because there the use of the idiom has been almost wiped
out.
b) This element by itself would be enough to exclude any thoughts of repatriation
of the P/R (political refugees) who now reside in Yugoslavia and who have been
brought up with the “Macedonian idea”, the “Macedonian language and culture”,
independently of their participation or not in the organizations SNOF, NOF and
activities for detaching Greek territories during the period 1946-1949
c) As for evidence it is imperative to:
1. The creation of a state institution that will depend from the Prefectures
of the regions near the borders, lined with the suitable and specially trained
to the “Plot against Macedonia” subject, personnel.
This institution will engage itself only with this subject, with the supervision
of the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and will collaborate closely, but in secret
with the Security Authorities and all the Public Services (Tax office, Schools,
Army, Church, etc)
2. In the public services and especially in the educational institutions
the employees who will be in service have to be ignorant of the local idiom.
3. The establishment of special enlightenment seminaries, for all the public
service employees and the clergy who are in service in the sensitive region of
Macedonia.
4. The establishment of motivations for the obligatory residence of the
public servants and other employees, in the quarters of their service (example:
payment of the rent, extra pay, etc.)
5. Establishment of the Cultural Association, like “ARISTOTELIS” in Florina
and economic help to them, for the realization of events and the publishing of
books, newspapers, magazines, etc. And afterwards these will be sent to the Diaspora
abroad who has origins from the regions of the senders. This will boost their
national sentiment and they will be protected from the anti-Hellenic propaganda
that is been practiced by S/M (Slavmacedonians) organizations.
6. Insertion of various obstacles (non-recognition of diplomas, postponement
of military service, etc.) for the Greek students who wish to study in Skopje.
7. Marking in each village of persons who due to their kin bounds and their
personality influence a large circle of co-villagers and with any means (even
with money payments) get close to them and use them properly so they will behave
as the fighters of the use of the idiom in their circle. To this direction a
very positive and effective role can be that of the Younger of the political
parties, by the judgment and coordination of the Government, when a between parties
agreement will be reached.
8. Recruitment in the Armed Forces, in Police Bodies in the public services
and Organizations of employees with origins from Florina region, by exception,
and their obligatory location in other areas of the country.
9. The encouragement, by the leadership of the Army of meetings and marriages
of Army officers, who are on duty, there and have origins abroad, with women
that speak the idiom.
THE CHIEF DIMITRIS KAPELARIS ANT/GOS
http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/3338/1/
Posted by RMK
Long lost Pelagonian Kindgom Discovered!?
http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/3657/2/
Archeologists are certain the locality of Bonce is
the long lost fourth Macedonian kingdom, the city of Pelagonia. The latest
discoveries led by Professor Viktor Lilcic showed a massive royal grave
site, one of a kind in the Balkans.
The only other similar site is Pella in Aegean Macedonia. “According to
the way this was built, the brilliance behind it, and just from the sheer size
of the grave site, we believe the king of Pelagonia had been buried here. Unfortunately,
we still don’t know who.” says Dr. Antonio Jakimovski, coordinator of Archeological
Research.
The grave site is from the 4th century B.C. when the kingdom of the Pelagonians
was around. It was suggested the site had been robbed even in Antic times.
“This is one of the rarest gravesites not just in the Balkans, but globally
that goes back to the 4th century BC.” says Jakimovski.
The site is located right underneath the hill of Visoka where it is suggested
to be the site of the city of Pelagonia. Unfortunately, the Government did not
allocate funds this year for the Visoka location.
Archeologists have been searching for the city of
Pelagonia and the Pelagonian kingdom for more than 150 years.
This find will undoubtedly make funds available for Visoka in 2009.
Just two years ago, near the hill of Visoka were discovered
three Macedonian Shields of King Demetrij with the Vergina Sun embedded
on them. The shields are currently undergoing restorations.
When completed, the world will see for the first time how the shields of
the Macedonian phalanx looked.
A friend of mine forwarded me this interesting exchange of views that seems to be from the Modern Greek Studies.
Thought you might find this exchange of views interesting
The post below is interesting in many ways.
a) Like it or not, human rights have now become an important factor in
state decision-making (see inter alia Leslie H. Gelb and Justine A. Rosenthal,
“The Rise of Ethics in Foreign Policy: Reaching a Values Consensus,” Foreign
Affairs 82.3 (May/June 2003), 2-7)). That means that the Greeks and Kurds of
Imbros, the Vlachs of Bitola, and the Slavic Macedonians of Florina all have
standing and must be recognized in court. This often causes the host government
discomfort.
b) Claims of "rights" can be used for good and ill. Milosevic
inflated the numbers of ethnic Serbs in the Republic of Macedonia in the 1992-93
period, for instance. Each of these claims needs to be weighed impartially,
not dismissed with a "guilt by similarity" argument. (Look! The Nazis
made claims of minority rights! Ergo, minority rights are a Nazi fabrication!)
c) Mr. Caratzas asserts without hesitation that the right of repatriation
and of property were taken from Slavic Macedonians in the 1940s. It is good
to have that stipulated. The problem comes with his added assertion that they "fought
the Greek state."
This is a problem because a substantial number of ethnic Greeks also "fought
the Greek state" and went to Tashkent, Yugoslavia and so on.
These individuals were welcomed back into Greece in the 1980s, under laws
that specifically excluded Slavic Macedonians (quoted below, after Mr. Caratzas'
post). What Mr. Caratzas is confirming, without acknowledging it, is that
some who "fought the Greek state" were more equal than others. The
law even permitted them to recover their property: in the tens of thousands.
This makes it clear that fighting on the losing side in the Greek Civil War
was not so horrible: it was, rather, fighting on the losing side while having
a Slavic ethnic background. Similarly in the USA, African-Americans are
sometimes stopped without reason by the police.
They have come to refer to this as the "crime" of "driving
while black."
d) Arguments built on supposed affiliations with World War II groups require
careful substantiation. And they are inevitably complex, since many ethnic Greeks,
some quite prominent, fought in the security battalions or with the Germans. Mr.
Caratzas might have
told us that the grandfather of the president of the Republic of Macedonia,
from Florina, did not collaborate with the Germans at all, because he'd already
died fighting in the Albanian campaign, in the service of the Greek state.
In short, what Mr. Caratzas has done is explicitly state that Slavic Macedonians
from Greece are being discriminated against (by the 1980s laws, among other things),
while "Greek Greeks" are not. It's good to have that made clear.
I have not responded earlier, because I do not want to use or abuse this
listserv as a political discussion list, and I'm passing over additional topics. But
here, there is a need for accuracy and
setting the historical record straight: being on the losing side (or being
a child of those on the losing side) in the 1940s is no longer prima facie
justification for exile. Ethnicity is.
Dan Tompkins
On Sep 1, 2008, at 5:33 AM, Aristide D. Caratzas wrote:
This lady touched on the question of properties "on the Greek side
of the border," something that has become one of the additional political
issues raised by FYROM's Gruevsky in the dispute with Greece over his statelet's
name.
It is not easy to know whether the 70-year old lady is a child or descendant
of those that fought the Greek state once or twice; if she has a Greek identity
(whether Greek, Slav or Vlach-speaking), from the former, i.e. related to the
Greek communists who took part in the rebellion of 1946-49, then she may have
a claim, however tendentious.
If she is from the latter it is another matter: these were Slavo-Macedonians,
who first collaborated with the Axis occupation forces-- many thousands going
so far as a) to join Italian fascist-sponsored militias that terrorized the (Greek)
Macedonian countryside, then units organized by the Germans on Himmler's direct
instructions to the nationalist VMRO organization (the forebear of Gruevsky's
governing party, which bears the same name today), and then b), upon the defeat
of the Axis, to ally themselves with the Greek communists in the aforementioned
rebellion.
Despite the protestations of Gruevsky and his VMRO party, all properties
of Slavo-Macedonain Axis collaborators (and later allies of the communists),
were seized after 1945, but especially 1949.
These actions by the Greek state were not unique in the post-war context
of dealing with collaborators. There are few serious people today who would advocate
even a discussion regarding an issue of Sudeten German properties in the Czech
Republic, even fewer those who would discuss German property rights in Gdansk
(formerly Danzig) or other regions with German ethnic minorities.
It is ironic that the issue of minority "rights" before the Second
World War was taken up with special enthusiasm by the Germans, who used it to
pressure other states, and went so far as to enlist many ethnic and religious
(i.e. Bosnian Muslims) minorities in specially-designated SS units and auxiliaries.
The "Macedonian" (sic) VMRO fits in this context. It is also interesting
that one of the earliest visions of a (politically) independent republic of Macedonia
was by Ivan Mihailov, the VMRO leader of the thirties and forties, friend and
mentor of Anton Pavelic of Ustashe fame and Heinrich Himmler. In the waning days
of the German occupation (1944) Himmler sponsored the concept of the creation
of a "Republic of Macedonia" to cover northern Greece and today's statelet
that has adopted that designation. Mihailov realized that the Germans could not
give him cover and the Bulgarians were by then hostile, so he did not proceed
to implement that vision.
Finally, it has been interesting, if troubling, to observe that US policy
planners since the 1990s (many of them quite liberal politically) effectively
followed a parallel policy path to which I refer above, i.e. establishing ethnic
minority hagiologies which then were used as a justification for (often heavy-handed)
intervention in the affairs of sovereign states.
Aristide Caratzas
DENYING ETHNIC IDENTITY
The
Macedonians of Greece
Human Rights Watch/Helsinki (formerly Helsinki Watch) New York, Washington, Los Angeles, London. 1994. Pp. 27-29.
Thousands of ethnic Macedonians--the number is in dispute--fled Greece
after the Greek Civil War (1946-49). In the late 1940s and early 1950s, the
Greek government stripped / these exiles of their Greek citizenship.
In 1982 the Greek government enacted an amnesty law (Law No. 400/76) permitting
repatriation and return of Greek citizenship to these political refugees. However,
the ministerial decree ordering these actions stated that those free to return
were "all Greeks by genus [origin] who during the Civil War of 1946-1949
and because of it have fled abroad as political refugees."
The phrase "by genus" is interpreted by the Greek government to
mean all those who identify themselves primarily as Greeks, and not as Macedonians,
regardless of their birthplace or heritage. Those who consider themselves
Macedonians, although born in Greece or children of parents born in Greece,
have been unable to avail themselves of the opportunity to return to Greece
and resume their citizenship and, in many cases, property.
Among those stripped of their citizenship were families--wives, children,
other relatives--of Macedonians who had fought with the Partisans. No individual
hearings were held as to the actions of family members or, in fact, of Partisans
themselves. All were stripped of citizenship without the internationally-accepted
rights to due process: the presumption of innocence; notice of the charges; a
fair hearing before an independent and impartial tribunal; opportunity to defend
oneself, including the right to confront witnesses and to present witnesses on
one's own behalf, and legal representation.
Refugees who identify themselves as "Greek," however, are permitted
to return. Human Rights Watch/Helsinki has not been able to determine the exact
number of "Greek-identified" political refugees who returned under
this law.
Responding to questions from Human Rights Watch/Helsinki about the number
of people who took advantage of the law, the Greek Foreign Ministry said: In
the period between 1974 and 1981 [before the law was passed], approximately 35,000
persons were repatriated, while
in the period between 1981 and 1987 [partly before and partly after the passage
of the law] the process was completed with the return to Greece of another
17,000 persons, approximately.
Law no. 1540/85 of April 10, 1985, stated that political refugees could
regain property taken by the Greek government as long as they were "Greeks
by genus."
Posted by Thomas
Not another BIG Greek Lie?
Denial of Ethnic Identity
http://www.mfa.gov.tr/denial-of-ethnic-identity.en.mfa
General Situation:
The Greek Nation is based on the principle of belonging to the Greek race
and the Greek Orthodox Church. On this subject, it is enough to glance at the
speeches of the Greek statesmen about the "homogeneity of the Greek nation
with the exception of the Muslim minority." These are out-dated concepts.
There are plenty of reports issued by the International Human Rights Organizations
documenting the persecution of the Turkish Minority in Western Thrace.
If the Greek Nation is really homogeneous, one can not help but wonder
about the destiny of the Albanians, the Muslim Albanians, Vlahs, Macedonians,
Bulgarians, Jews as well as the Turks.
In this respect, it becomes necessary to answer the question of how homogeneity
has been achieved in Greek Macedonia while ethnic variety still survives in the
Republic of Macedonia.
The very existence of a Turkish Minority is officially denied in Greece.
Indeed any allusion to it is punishable by law. The post office refuses to accept
written communications that contain any reference to the Turkish identity of
the Minority. Government leaders, even the Parliament, turn down petitions on
behalf of the Minority when addressed in the name of the "Turkish" Minority.
Lawsuits were filed against the leaders of the Turkish Minority the late
Dr. Sadık Ahmet and Ibrahim Serif, during the elections of 1989, for distributing
campaign leaflets that referred to the Minority as Turkish.
Many members of the Turkish Minority were prosecuted during local elections
on October 16, 1994 for having used the word "Turkish" in their campaign
documents.
The Greek Government asserted in the years of 1954 and 1955 that the Minority
was originated from the Turkish race, but later, changed its mind.
The methods which Greece uses to destroy the ethnic identity of the minority
are described in the report "Destroying Ethnic Identity - The Turks of Greece" published
by "Helsinki Watch" in 1990.
Human Rights Watch report of 1999 is also indicative of the problems faced
by the Turkish Minority.
The Turkish identity of the minority has been established in several ways.
The instruction which was conveyed to the subordinate departments by the General
Secretary of Thrace, Fesopulos in 1954, saying that the minority should be called
as the "Turkish Minority" must also be mentioned. This notice was repeated
one year later in 1955.
Moreover, according to the provisions of the Agreement on the Exchange
of Turkish and Greek Populations on January 30, 1923, the people of Greek and
Turkish origin who were left out of the exchange procedure were given "Etabli
Documents". These documents mentioned their ethnic origin as Greek and Turkish.
At the international level, the document of the League of Nations submitted
to the Council on December 23, 1924 and remarked C. 774 on the "Minorities
of Turkish Race In Western Thrace", should also be cited.
Greek courts also have outlawed the use of the term 'Turkish Minority'.
In 1988, the Greek High Court upheld a 1986 decision by the Court of Appeals
of Thrace shutting down the Turkish Teachers Union of Western Thrace. The Court
held that the word "Turkish" referred to citizens of Turkey and that
the use of the word "Turkish" to describe Greek Moslems endangered
public order. This decision led to vigorous protests from the Turkish Minority.
As a result of the High Court's decision, most Turkish associations have remained
closed.
In this context, the banning of the Turkish Minority associations; namely,
the “Western Thrace Turkish Teacher’s Union”, the “Komotini Turkish Youth Association”
and the “Turkish Union of Xanthi” has continued until today. Following the exhaustion
of the internal remedies, the case concerning the banning of the Turkish Union
of Xanthi was taken to the ECHR by the Minority. Also the efforts to establish
the “Rodopi Turkish Woman Association” and the “Evros Prefecture Minority Youth
Association” proved futile based on the same pretexts of the Greek authorities
and these cases were also taken to the ECHR by the Minority.
The European Court of Human Rights expressed its decision, in a press release
dated 11 October 2007, regarding the “Evros Prefecture Minority Youth Association”,
to which Greek authorities failed to give the necessary permission. The Court
held unanimously that there had been a violation of Article 11 (freedom of assembly
and association) of the European Convention on Human Rights.
The decision became effective as of 11 January 2008.
The European Court of Human Rights also expressed its decision concerning
the “Turkish Union of Xanthi” and the “Rodopi Turkish Women’s Association” on
27 March 2008.
The Court held unanimously that there had been a violation of Article 11
(freedom of assembly and association) of the European Convention on Human Rights
in both aforementioned cases. The Court also held unanimously that there had
been a violation of Article 6 & 1 (right to a fair hearing within a reasonable
time) of the Convention. In the case of the “Turkish Union of Xanthi”, the Court
awarded the said association 8000 Euros in respect of non-pecuniary damage.
These decisions once again prove the restrictions imposed by the Greek
administration not only on the freedom of assembly and association but also on
the right to express ethnic identity.
From the International Scene
The Macedonian Language IS the Macedonian Language
BBC.Macedonian.com
September 12, 2008
Translated and edited by Risto Stefov
Dr. Victor Friedman is a well known American Slavist who is currently attending the International Slavist Congress in Ohrid.
As an expert in the Macedonian language, history and culture BBC questioned Dr. Friedman about his thoughts in view of the Greek-Macedonian talks around the name and the terrible consequences around the identity and language of the Macedonian people.
V. F. “As an outsider I know the entire history, I am telling you that Greece is in a position of strength and has nothing to fear from Macedonia, there is no reason for the Republic of Macedonia to not remain the way it is, those are my thoughts.”
BBC. There is a lot of talk not only about the question of the name but also about the identity and language.
V. F. “I have always maintained that the Macedonian language is affirmed as such in the linguistic world, it is well known that the Macedonian language is what it is. Not only as a language spoken in Macedonia but also as a language spoken in other countries. If the decision is something else, always the Macedonian language will remain the Macedonian language. When we talk about the language, the name of the language is what it is. Names of languages however do change. For example 200 years ago the Greek language was called “Romaika” – Roman, meaning 200 years ago the Greeks were Romans. And as such …names change.”
BBC. How can that reflect on the entire identity of the Macedonian people which cannot identify itself any differently?
V. F. “Macedonians live in Macedonia and are called Macedonians. I think it’s not a big problem. In Russia they say they are Russians and not Slavo-Russians even though many different people live in Russia. There is no problem for Slavs to call themselves Russians and the others to call themselves something else. The same can be with the Macedonians and others who live in Macedonia. I think that if we do not call the Russians Slavo-Russians then we don’t need to call the Macedonians Slavo-Macedonians.”
BBC. How do you rate the European Union’s position in regards to this question?
V. F. “I feel since Yugoslavia broke up, Macedonia was unique in fulfilling all the requirements for recognition but was not recognized by the European Union, I see the EU as something not very consistent” said the American Slavist Dr. Victor Freidman in an interview with the BBC.
Macedonian Samurai defeat Greeks, in Greece
Macedonia earned a bronze medal in Kendo, the ancient
Japanese Martial Art discipline. The Greeks had made plans for their lunch,
the inexperienced Macedonian Kendo National team. However, the stubborn
neighbors made different plans, defended their name, defeating the hosts
in Volos, 3-1.
Macedonia is recently admitted member of the European Kendo Federation
(less than a year), had beaten the experienced Greek team for the bronze medal
at the Balkan Championship held this weekend in Greece.
Greece is a member of the European Kendo Federation for over 15 years,
but the Macedonian heart defeated all barriers that the host purposely put up.
Macedonia’s troubles started as expected, at the border. -Their customs
officials held us there for hours. They turned over every piece of paper and
clothing we had on us, looking for something so they would not let us pass. But,
they did not find anything and after several hours we were allowed to enter -
says Zlatko Keskovski, Kendo Master and national team member.
The Macedonian national team consisted of members Andrej Atanasovski, Mensur
Bojda, Nikola Baleski and Matej Josevski.
The terror waged on the Macedonian Kendo national team was transferred
from the border over to the local authorities in Volos. To intimidate the Macedonians,
Greek authorities sent members of the Anti-Terror Unit to watch the training
of the Red and Yellow team.
- Their authorities were fairly agitated. We are accepted in the European
Kendo Federation under the name Macedonia, with the MKD abbreviation. The Greek
hosts tried to scare us, we were told we would be eliminated from competition.
We did not budge and told them we will sue them. This went back and forth and
the start of the Tournament was delayed by three hours. The Greeks saw that we
would not back down, and the other national teams started to get angry with the
Greek hosts, so the Tournament started.
FIXED DRAW
The clever and experienced Greeks thought of a very good way to humiliate
Macedonia, by fixing a draw against the Macedonian team, what they considered
to be the least experienced team from all the teams in the competition.
-The draw was fixed, even the other national teams knew it. The Greeks
even brought in TV Crews to record the huge victory for Greece. But, they left
the battlefield humiliated, in front of their fans. The Greeks had no chance
against the Macedonians. They were shocked by the loss, did not wish to shake
hands, but were forced to do so because of the Japanese Tradition -continues
Keskovski.
After Macedonia won its bronze, it lost to the new Balkan champion, Montenegro,
though it did win the hearts of the rest of the five national teams, Greece being
the only exception.
- We are Macedonians to everyone. The rest of the teams were shocked by
Greek behavior. The Bulgarians and Montenegrins were particularly disgusted.
Greek Debacle watched by 1000 fans live. Greek defeat did not cool off the hosts
who demanded the Macedonian National team to quickly leave the Tournament fearing
for their safety.
- We were told the fans would attack us. We have swords we said, no need
to be in a rush to leave, besides, the TV Crew which supposedly came to capture
the “Greek Glory“, I am pretty sure did not broadcast the match- joked Zlatko
Posted by Megaman
Issues
Of the Macedonian Community of Victoria’s “Macedonia! Macedonian!
Forever!” March to Parliament
WHEREAS, Macedonia and its Macedonian people were forcibly divided amongst Greece, Serbia, Bulgaria and Albania in 1912-1913;
WHEREAS, Macedonia’s division marked the beginning of a century long campaign by Greece, Serbia, and Bulgaria to eradicate the Macedonian people and identity;
WHEREAS, Greece and Bulgaria to this day deny the existence of a distinct ethnic Macedonian identity both within and outside their modern political borders; and
WHEREAS, Greece denies the Republic of Macedonia its fundamental and inalienable right to exist and be known by its historical and constitutional name.
THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED that the Macedonian Community of Victoria and Australia,
1. Proclaims the undeniable fact that the Republic of Macedonia, the Macedonian people and ethnic Macedonian identity exist and gathers before the Parliament of Victoria as testament to the existence of the ethnic Macedonian identity in Australia;
2. Affirms the fundamental and inalienable right of ethnic Macedonians to their identity and the fundamental and inalienable right of the Republic of Macedonia to its historical and constitutional name under customary international law;
3. Rejects and strongly condemns all attempts by Greece and Bulgaria and any other person, body or state to deny, limit or qualify our Macedonian identity and Macedonian name in any way whatsoever;
4. Demands that the Australian Government immediately withdraw its derogatory and discriminatory directive of 1994 which re-named the Macedonian identity as “Slav-Macedonian” and apologize to its ethnic Macedonian citizens for the pain and insult caused by this directive;
5. Calls upon the Australian Government to follow the example of the United States of America, China, Russia, Canada and 120 other countries and recognize the Republic of Macedonia by its historical and constitutional name in accordance with its obligations under customary international law;
6. Strongly condemns the United Nations for imposing upon the Republic of Macedonia the absurd provisional name “Former Yugoslav Republic of Macedonia” in blatant violation of Article 4 of the United Nations Charter, and demands that the United Nations rectify this illegality by immediately resolving to refer to the Republic of Macedonia from hereon solely by its historical and constitutional name;
7. Calls upon the Government of the Republic of Macedonia to immediately discontinue all negotiations with Greece regarding its name and warns the Republic of Macedonia, Greece and the International Community that ethnic Macedonians worldwide are united in their resolve to defend their ethnic Macedonian identity and accept no other name but “Macedonia” for their State;
8. Demands that Greece and Bulgaria immediately end their century long campaign of genocide against the ethnic Macedonian identity and State and appeals to Australia and the International Community to pressure Greece and Bulgaria to recognize and afford the ethnic Macedonians of Greece and Bulgaria their guaranteed human rights and fundamental freedoms under customary international law;
9. Strongly condemns NATO for withholding its invitation to the Republic of Macedonia to join NATO until such time that Greece’s issue with its name is resolved. As the Republic of Macedonia fulfills all admission requirements to NATO and Greece’s denial of the Republic of Macedonia to its historical and constitutional name is in violation of customary international law, we demand that NATO immediately issue its invitation to the Republic of Macedonia for admission to NATO under its historical and constitutional name; and
10. Calls upon the European Union not to repeat the legal and ethical errors of the United Nations and NATO before it, and to negotiate with the Republic of Macedonia its admission to the European Union under its historical and constitutional name and in strict compliance with NATO’s admission requirements.
MACEDONIANS
What does it feel like being a Macedonian from the Aegean part, which has been illegally occupied since 1913 by Greece, "the so called cradle of democracy"?
http://www.australianmacedonianweekly.com/edition/1043_30092008/070_english.html
How sad it is to watch the Macedonian people to be
terrorized and locked in cruel jails. All the people crying clothed in
black and shedding tears of blood.
This has been the tragedy of our Macedonian people that were torn apart
by the European powers of France, Britain, Germany and Tsarist Russia. They donated
Aegean Macedonia to Greece, Pirin to Bulgaria, Vardar to Serbia and Prespa to
Albania.
When the then powers divided our country Macedonia, the illegal occupiers
signed certain treaties under the Bucharest Agreement, but not one of them carried
out their obligations.
1. All ethnic Macedonians (and others) were to have schools in their own
language.
2. Freedom for all cultural activities.
3. To have their own churches to worship and sermon and liturgy in Macedonian.
Not one of these illegal occupiers carried out their obligations. The righteous
European powers pretend to be blind and deaf to the abhorrent treatment meted
out to Macedonians.
Only one part is free, the other 3 still remain suppressed, denied the very
basic human rights under the tyrannical illegal occupiers. There appears
to be one law for their favored friends and for everyone else.
European powers - Britain, France, Germany, Russia and now USA. No parts
of your land have been given away by others without your approval or consent.
Had this happened I feel sure you’d raise hell and heaven in protests!
During 1924-1925 the League of Nations called on Greece to produce and
print the Abacedar book in the Macedonian language but Latin letters.
In July 1925 a meeting was held in the Balkans. Greece distributed the
Abacedar book to the Bulgarian and Serbian delegates. They furiously rejected
the document because it was printed in the Macedonian language. Not in Serbian,
Bulgarian or Greek.
Vasilis Dandramis a very high ranking Greek Government delegate produced
maps and other evidence and argued that Macedonians exist, existed, and have
their own language, they are neither Greeks, Bulgarians, Serbian or anything
else.
Why is the Greek government so adamantly trying to deny the above? "Have
they forgotten to clean out the skeletons from their cupboard of 1925??"
Macedonians are one of the oldest indigenous people that have lived in
Europe and the Balkans.
Alexander the Great of Macedon conquered the world with great military
deeds which to this day have never been equaled.
He has been acclaimed as Commander of Commanders, what more need we say.
The younger historians the world over now have much better knowledge, confirmed
evidence about the true historical facts.
Myths and falsified history is gradually being cast aside.
The history of Europe will have to be turned upside down.
Falsifiers will meet their Waterloo.
Greece with its unjust, unsustainable claim "Macedonia is Greek" reeks
with hypocrisy to say the least. "The so called cradle of democracy of Greece:
doesn’t exist there. Terror (Tromokratia) yes.
Until 1991 the word Macedonia was anathema to all former and present Greek
Governments.
Always Voria Ellada was their norm. Historically it is well documented that
‘the clever Greeks’ are masters in falsifying, changing and stealing other
countries heritage and names.
Example in 1825 they got their first king in history, he was a Bavarian
Prince, named OTTO, low and behold in no time his name become OTTHOS! These ‘clever
Greeks’.
They will stoop to any low level as long it Glorifies Mega Ellada. Their
credibility is sinking fast.
Macedonians are peace loving people, are prepared to forgive, the Bulgarians,
Greeks, Serbs, Albanians and others for their wrongs committed.
We are part and parcel of the Balkans and Europe.
We are looking forward towards a peaceful future, where friendly relations
ill benefit all.
So allow me to conclude with an old valid Macedonian ILINDEN cry - Ne barame
bogatstvo, ne barame pari, BARAME SLOBODA I CHOVECHKI PRAVDINI).
Aegean Macedonian Association of Australia
Mihail Velovski
Atanas Strezovski
Concerns
Concern for the Greeks
The research by the Swiss Institute iGenea, frustrated
the Greeks. The iGenea Institute explores the genetics of European people,
and it is one of the leaders in the world in DNA analysis. The institute
confirmed that today's descendants of the ancient Macedonians are Macedonians.
When asked by a Greek citizen: "What is the origin of the Slavo-Macedonians?" The
iGenea on her official Forum replied:
First of all, they are Macedonians, not Slavo-Macedonians as you mention
because of your political reasons. The majority of Macedonians are direct descendants
of the ancient, and only a small part of them has Slavic origin. For the greater
disappointment of the Greeks iGenea revealed that 32% were of Hellenic Greek,
Macedonian, even Arab origin. Other 31% of Greeks have Celts, 12% German and
Slavic, and 11% have Illyrian origin.
For the Albanians and their faith iGenea confirmed the opposite of her
belief, iGenea says that it is the smallest percentage of Illyrian origin. Considering
the DNA analysis, only 20% of Albanians have Illyrian origin, while 40% of the
citizens of Bosnia and Herzegovina are direct descendants of the Illyrians.
In the last period is the official forum of the Swiss Institute iGenea
with questions fully, by the Greek citizens arrive, which is mostly about the
origin of the Macedonians instead of their own origin of interest. iGenea in
their centers, except for the DNA analysis, uses historical, anthropological
and archaeological resources.
Vecer: Macedonians tied to Antic Macedonians, Greeks
to Celtic, Germanic, Slavic...
http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/3717/1/
Today’s Macedonians are descendants of the Antic Macedonians, says research
results from the Swiss Genealogy Institute iGENEA. For a second time an independent
research institution confirms what Oxford and Madrid University confirmed a decade
ago.
iGENEA is the most famous global Genealogy institute who once again frustrated
the Greek government by confirming the direct connection between the Macedonians
today and in Antic times.
The question came from a Greek citizen who asked iGENEA the following question: "What
are the roots of today’s SlavMacedonians".
The Institute responded: "Before all, they are Macedonians, not Slav
Macedonians as you referred to them for political reasons. The largest part of
the Macedonians are direct descendants of the Antic Macedonians. Only a minor
portion have a Slavic connection".
iGENEA backed up their findings with hard numbers. However, tying the today's
Macedonians with Antic Macedonians is not the only disappointing information
for Greece. According to iGENEA, only 32 percent of Greek citizens have Macedonian,
Hellenic and even Arab origin. iGENEA further explains that 31 percent of Greek
citizens have Celtic roots, 12 percent Germanic and Slavic origin, while 11%
have Illyrian roots.
iGENEA also negated the Illyrians roots of the Albanians. In stark contrast
to Albanian beliefs, iGENEA says the Albanians have the least Illyrian roots.
Only 20 percent of the Albanians have Illyrian roots, while 40 percent of today’s
Bosnians have Illyrian roots.
In the past several months, the iGENEA Genealogy Institute had been flooded
with requests by Greek Citizens who, ironically, did not care for their own origin,
but all questions were aimed at the Macedonians' origin. iGENEA in its research
uses DNA analysis, historical, archeological, and anthropological sources. //26.09.08
(c) Vecer
Choices
Old Toronto Star articles on Macedonians
I recently got access to the digital archive of the
Toronto star, and I must say there are A LOT of articles about Macedonians
in Toronto and in Macedonia. I have found a large variety of articles ranging
from: "Biography of Todor Alexandrof" - "Macedonians in
Toronto planning to go to Macedonia and fight for freedom - 1912", "Two
Macedonian groups stab each other at Cyril & Methody Church - 1930",
Macedonians flee Greek Torture in Florina - Greek Civil War - Macedonians
Want their own country 1940s, Human Rights of Macedonians in Bulgaria and
Greece 1950s - Ethnic Tensions between Macedonian and Greek students in
Toronto high schools -1990s -Macedonian parade - Tensions between Macedonians
from Florina in Toronto - Greeks physically attack Toronto mayor over Macedonia
Name. These are just a few to name. There must be 10,000 articles on Macedonians
in the Toronto Star, as early as the late 1800s. I STRONGLY RECOMMEND FOR
THOSE WHO ARE INTERESTED IN MACEDONIAN IDENTITY AND HISTORY FROM 1890+
TO SUBSCRIBE TO THE TORONTO STAR'S "PAGES OF THE PAST". I can't
emphasize enough on how much information there is, especially on the early
Macedonians in Toronto.
***The Editorial/Opinion sections are just PRICELESS! Macedonian identity
in Toronto from the early 1900s was very strong, and it’s so interesting
on what these people had to say about their homeland during 1913, during
the Greek Civil War, early 1990s, etc.
The paid advertisements by MPO, Pan-Macs, and United Macedonians are very
interesting as well.
By Tsutsul Pase Goveda
Free Advice
Johann Gustav Droysen, creator of Greece's Fake History
http://macedoniaonline.eu/content/view/3659/49/
Perhaps it was convenient that Germany created Greece's
history. Only the Germans at the time understood how powerful history was,
especially if you twisted, invented and fake it.
People hear “Hellenistic this, Hellenistic that” all the time, envisioning
in their mind something very ‘old’, ancient if you will.
If you envisioned something old, you‘d be right, because it goes back to
1833. If you envisioned something ancient, sorry to disappoint you.
What happened in 1833? Greece had just gained its independence from the
Ottoman Empire. To be more precise it was given to her by France and Britain.
In return, Greece received a French appointed German ruler, Prince Otto.
Otto was a freshly arrived hit in Greece. He loved the ethnic soup there, though he grew a bit of concern as to how he would rule this people.
His biggest concern was Athens, where the Albanians
and Turkish dominated.
Prince Otto phoned his twenty seven (27) year old friend Johann Gustav
Droysen at Friedrich Wilhelm University. The student turned part time teacher
was such an authority on his subject “History” that he was a privatdozent and
then a professor (appointed by Otto) without a salary.
Even Prince Otto didn’t think he was good enough
to have a salary. Granted, friendship can sometimes go far, as in this
case. Johann was hired by Greece’s ruler to create the “new history” for
Greece, to unite the populace, give him an idea of a ‘language’ in such
a way that the populations wouldn’t be in a conflict.
Johann Gustav had recommended Albanian as the core language of Greece because
it dominated Athens. This idea didn’t go well with Prince Otto who explained
that people in and outside of Athens spoke Turkish as well. Besides, the idea
was to unite the populations.
Johann showed his cleverness by suggesting adopting the long lost Koine language. Imagine Americans today adopting what is now considered the dying Latin language.
Prince Otto loved Johann's idea and it was set in stone. Koine was the language. Better yet, the language was called “Greek”, the German born Greek ruler decided.
It was little known that Otto’s friend and “history” professor Johann Gustav had transferred to yet another University, this time at Kiel, where once again he was not able to get a salary. Shortly afterwards he made a decision to move into Politics! You’d think History would have worked out for him.
We are not done with Greece and Johann Gustav Droysen. Once the Koine language was introduced, Johann decided to further help Prince Otto in uniting the ethnic soup in Greece.
Hellenism.
This word was coined by none other than our remarkable History Professor turned Politician Johann Gustav in 1836.
I understand few of you are disappointed because this term doesn’t go back in ancient time as some believe. 1836 is the year, the word Hellenism was first coined. Not a minute before that. When you consider who created the word, any comment can be superfluous.
By all means, Johann did his job, he was tasked to ’unite’, not to divide. Yes, he went perhaps a bit too far with the Hellenism phrase, not to mention calling Koine 'Greek'.
I suggest to Macedonians to adopt the Hebrew language and call it "Macedonian", that way anything they find written in Hebrew, they can claim as being Macedonian. Easy enough, if you follow "Greek logic".
Perhaps, I’d accept the term “Hellenistic” to describe something that happened in Athens, though I don’t know what that would be, still, the term "Macedonistic" period should, and ought to be, used to cover any other historical references.
There is no denying that the period from Alexander the Great until well into the Roman time deals with Macedonian Dynasties, their rule, succession and their eventual interaction, or lack there of with the indigenous local populations throughout the Balkan Peninsula, Asia and Egypt.
The term "Hellenistic” can hardly do any justice to
historical scholarship since its coverage/domain leaves a huge section
of history barely touched. Hellenism, the term Johann Gustav Droysen gave
to this era, is such a narrow cultural belt of history that its usage is
not only misleading and inappropriate but it very much distorts and minimizes
the greatness of the ancient Macedonians.
Perhaps the Athenian contribution, from a cultural point of view, may be
argued to have occupied a place of some importance in the administrative sector
of the empire, the organizational, the military and the structural components
of the Macedonian Empire must have been obtained, delivered and maintained strictly
from Macedonian resources and for Macedonian interests.
The concept of an empire, an esoteric notion for the Athenians, was born with the first few initial successes of Alexander, and its meaning, magnitude, scope and structure grew as the string of victories and the success on the battlefields allowed Alexander to enlarge, coordinate and control huge land areas in Asia and Egypt. For almost 3 centuries after Alexander, it was his successors that carried the symbols and the name of the Macedonian Empire.
Thus, the very narrow strip of "Hellenism" that
comes, as a residue, attached to the period in question, cannot, in any
meaningful way, embrace and encompass the scope and the magnitude of an
empire that was built, organized and maintained on the strength and the
efficiency of the Macedonian army.
If Johann would be alive today to see what his fake history and the god-father
style of creating Greece has caused, I am certain he would have broken off his
friendship to Prince Otto.
Marina Sazdovska
Good Advice
Good advice to us all. I used to think that there were great tests we all had to pass, but nowadays I am more inclined to think that the greatest achievements are accomplished mostly through persistence, consistently showing up, participating, be it ever so humble, every day. We just have to remain steadfast in speaking the truth to the world and to each other, and the truth about Macedonia will prevail someday. The only Greek hope is to destroy the Macedonian spirit and the state will follow. They will, no doubt, try to starve the people out until they surrender their identity, or they will try to spread enough dissension among them that they will instead destroy each other and their state. However, I am an optimist, who believes that this will be difficult to impossible, and I believe that it is the young people of Macedonia who will not let this happen. For all of its tragedy, the death of Tose Proeski demonstrated the depth of feeling Macedonians share for the best spirit in their national life. I will be visiting family and friends in Macedonia October 16 through 29, Tetovo, Skopje, Ohrid and Shtip. I look forward to the opportunity to spend time again with so many of the good people of Macedonia.
Best wishes,
Michael Seraphinoff
Hi Risto,
Just to let you know that on Saturday evening Macedonia defeated Scotland in a World Cup Qualifier 1-0 in Skopje. The interesting thing is for the first time on free to air TV in Sydney the result was shown as: Macedonia 1 Scotland 0. Also, on Foxtel pay TV on Eurosports in was shown as Rep. of Macedonia 1 Scotland 0. I was pleased that FYROM has finally dropped.......
My opinion is that we should not negotiate with Nimitz or Greece, as evolution will drop FYROM and only use Republic of Macedonia.
Regards,
Jimmy (aka Cannon)
History
On 5 November 812 Mesembria fell. It was now clear
to Michael that he must march once more against his adversary; and this
time he must win. All that winter he spent gathering his troops, from every
corner of the Empire; and in May 813 he set out. The following month, on
the field of Versinicia near Adrianople, the armies came face to face;
and on 22 June John Aplakes, commander of the Macedonians on the left wing,
led his men into the attack. The Bulgars fell back in confusion, and for
a moment it looked as if the battle were over almost before it had begun.
But then an astonishing thing happened: the Anatolian troops on the right,
commanded by an Armenian named Leo, suddenly turned tail and fled from
the field. At first, we are told, Krum stood incredulous; then he and his
men fell on the luckless Macedonians and slaughtered them wholesale.
“A Short History of Byzantium (Based on the Great Three-Volume Work)” by
John Julius Norwich, page 126.
Posted by TrueMacedonian
http://books.google.com/books?id=xDINAA
... &ct=result
The above link is from the book History of Greece by George Finlay and
he states that "John Aplakes, General of the Macedonian and Thracian forces" and
that "they consisted chiefly of hardy Sclavonians".
Could it be that John Aplakes was actually a Macedonian
himself? Macedonians fighting Bulgars??? Evidently John Aplakes would have
had to speak Macedonian to his army.
Is this an unsung Macedonian hero? I will have to say yes.
Stories
AUSTRALIAN ABORIGINAL RELIGION
Aboriginies first arrived in Australia about 40,000
years ago at a time when there was a land bridge between Asia and Australia.
Over time much of the continent came to be occupied and cut off from Asia
as a result of rising sea levels.
A key aspect of Australian aboriginal belief is the Dreaming. At the heart
of this is the belief in powerful beings who arose out of the land, created or gave
birth to people, plant life and animal life, and connected particular groups
of people with particular regions and languages. The Dreaming beings continue
to control the natural world, but their willingness to release the powers of
fertility depends upon people continuing to perform certain rituals.
People are believed to possess spirits which originate from the dreaming.
As children grow up they undergo a variety of rites of passage which initiate
them into adulthood. Boys would be subjected to practices such as circumcision,
subincision into the urethra, blood letting or tooth pulling. Girls would be
ritually decorated, and subject to partial seclusion or food taboos.
Totemism was also important to the aboriginal world view. The representation
of mythic or living beings was seen to provide the means to access the spiritual
power of Dreaming.
http://philtar.ucsm.ac.uk/encyclopedia/westoc/abor.html
The "S-lo vene" ("Zhivi-li zhivee") or "life giving-Sun
god li lives" religious terminology is also present in the culture of the
Australian Aboriginies.
Kirribilli House (Sydney). The Australian PM's residence. Ki-rri > Ki>Gi>Zhi > Zhi(vi)-ri/the
life giving-Sun god ra, bi-lli > ve'-li/lives-li.
David Gulpilil (Aboriginal Actor) Gu-l > Zhi(vi)-li/the life giving-Sun
god li, pi-li(l) > ve'-li/lives-li.
The Gamaraigal people. Ga > Zhe/Zeus, ma-rai > Mara/Mother-Rhea
(Mother of Zeus), ga-l > Zhi(vi)-l(i)/the life giving-Sun god li (Father of
Zeus).
Walloogoobal (A place). Wa-loo > Ve'-li/Lives li, goo-ba(l) > zhe-ve'/zeus
lives.
Booragoon (A place). Boo-ra goo(n)> Ve'-ra (i) zhe/Lives ra & zeus.
Iliwara (A place). I-li > (zhiv)I-li/the life giving-Sun god li, wa-ra > ve'-ra/lives
ra.
Iringili (A place). I-rin > (zhiv)I-rin/the life giving-Sun god ra,
gi-li > Zh(iv)i-li/the life giving-Sun god li.
Recent independent DNA and Genetic experiments conclude:
1. Macedonians belong to the "older" Mediterranean substratum.
2. Macedonians are not related with geographically close so-called "Greeks" who
do not belong to the "older" Mediterranean substratum.
-It's obvious, the Ancient Macedonians were a bunch of indigenous united
proto-Slavic tribes who came from "Mother of Zeus State"!
By Vasko
Early Phoenician Foundations (Scota and Gaedel -part 9)
Ellis: ".....Unfortunately, the history of the
Phoenicians is shrouded in mystery, and it is only through mythology that
a tentative homeland in Scythia, modern Ukraine, is implied........"
The similarity between the Therans and the Hyksos-Israelites was most
probably intensified after Ahmose I of Upper Egypt overran Avaris in 1580
BC, as they now had the significant bond of a common tragedy and thus a common
heritage and history.
AN EARLY WAVE OF THERAN AND HYKSOS-ISRAELITE MIGRANTS WOULD
HAVE SET OUT FROM LOWER EGYPT AND SETTLED IN COASTAL SETTLEMENTS
ALL ACROSS THE EASTERN MEDITERRANEAN. BEING SEABORN MIGRANTS, THEY WOULD NO DOUBT
HAVE MET AND HAD CLOSE LINKS WITH THE OTHER MAJOR MARITIME NATION IN THIS
EARLY ERA, THE MINOANS.
Meanwhile in Lower Egypt, the bond between the Theran
and Hyksos-Israelite peoples must have endured through the following
generations, because some two hundred years later another pharaoh of Egypt
was again adopting and promoting the naturalistic art forms of the Theran-Minoans.
This pharaoh was Akhenaton and he was related in some way to the previous
Hyksos-Israelite regime in Avaris. Akhenaton's artistic reforms have often
been said to have been unique and revolutionary, but this is not at all
correct. While Akhenaton's artistic preference was unique to Middle and
Upper Egypt, it has exact parallels and similarities with the Theran-Minoan
artwork of Avaris.
Vivian Davies: "Much comment has been made on the Minoan character
of the nature scenes at Amarna, which along with the large quantities of Mycenaean
pottery found at the site has suggested to some (that there was) an Aegean influence
in the art. However, nature scenes are not typical of Mycenaean art but of Minoan
art; and Minoan painting was a thing of the past by the time of Amarna."
In this quotation, Vivian Davies is pointing out that although the artwork
at Amarna looks distinctly Minoan, the Minoan empire had all but collapsed by
this time. So how did Minoan artwork suddenly appear at Amarna? When the Hyksos
related Amenhotep pharaohs again rose to power in Egypt a century or more later,
these Theran-Minoan influences were still strong within this community. Hence
the style of Theran-Minoan artwork survived the slow demise of the Minoan empire
on Crete, and hence Akhenaton (Amenhotep IV) had a strong appreciation for this
'unusual' naturalistic artwork.
It should perhaps also be pointed out that some aspects of Minoan
culture were definitely not supported by Akhenaton, and that included bull-worship.
Akhenaton was the brother of the biblical Moses (TuthMoses), and so he was closely
linked to the (second) exodus from Egypt. The biblical accounts make a great
play on the difficulties that Moses was having with bull worshippers.
That the Upper Egyptians still worshipped the Apis-bull is well known,
but why any of these people should wish to follow Moses and Akhenaton's Atonist
regime on the exodus remained a complete mystery. However, if these renegade
bull worshippers were not Egyptian Apis worshippers but the remnants and
descendants of the Theran-Minoans, who had long venerated the bull in their
own idiosyncratic way, then the mystery may well be solved. But if this is so
then the alliance between the Therans and Akhenaton must have fallen apart during
this (second) exodus, because the Bible reports that many battles were fought
between the followers of Moses and the bull worshippers who accompanied them.
Scota: Egyptian Queen of The Scots, by Ralph Ellis, Adventures Unlimited,
USA, Pages 86, 92-93.
RE: Linear A (Scota and Gaedel -part 8)
Risto, before I give you my reply to the Etocretan
and Phoenician languages, I'd like to first mention a few things about
the proto-Slav Veneti.
-The "Vincha Culture" archeological site (proto-Slavic) at
Banjica, near Belgrade, in particular, is of significance. According to the C-14
method, its artifacts have been assessed as dating no later than 3,473 BC.
-There is evidence of the movement of people from Anatolia to the Cycladic
islands and then on to the territory of what is today the middle of mainland "Greece" at
around 2,300 BC (also most probably later related proto-Slavs).
-The first known nation of central Europe (according to the authors of
the book "Veneti: First Builders of European Community") were the Proto-Slavic
Veneti and the original language of central Europe before the arrival of the
Indo-Europeans around 2,000 BC was Slavic.
-According to Vesna Pesic, it has been the sea-faring, merchant rivermen,
the Veneti, who disseminated the Vincha script to the Etruscans as early as the
end of the second millenium BC.
-The later 'Eur-African' City States tradition that the Phrygian
(or Brygian) migration (back?!) into Anatolia in the 12th century BC having
originated in 'Macedonia' and Thrace was based on another often-encountered claim,
namely, that both of their northern neighbours spoke the same language. In other
words, according to the citizens of the ancient City States, both the Phrygians
and the Thracians spoke the same language, which today is proving to have Slavic
origins.
-The people that constituted the 10th century BC "Macedonians",
belonged to (or were related to) the Central European family of the proto-Slav
Veneti. Herodotus (in the 5th century BC) claims that the Pelazgi occupied
parts of Macedonia and parts of the ancient City States even before the Athenians
came into existence. The Pelazgi were one of the indigenous groups of people
from the Indo-European era that Herodotus called barbarians who spoke a barbarian
language. Later, even though some Pelazgi lived among the Athenians, they were
considered by the Athenians, to be non-Athenian, a barbaric race indigenous to
the region. (Herodotus: from The History, c. 430 BC, 1.56-59). Given that they
were non-Athenian speakers, and the fact that they were seen as barbarians even
though some lived in Athens, it is conceivable that the Pelazgi belonged to the
larger family of Indo-Europeans, the proto-Slav Veneti.
-If the Pelazgi, the ancient pre-Hellenic people, who occupied "Greece" before
the 12th century BC, and who were said to have inhabited Thrace, Argos, Crete,
and Chalcidice, had their own alphabet, it unquestionably predated the alleged
import of the "Greek" from the Phoenician (around the 9th century BC).
(History of the Macedonian People from Ancient Times to
the Present, by Chris Stefou, Webcom Limited, Canada, 2005, Pages 16, 31,
32, 34)
Reply:
"Vene-ti" > "Vene" > Ve' > zhivee > Lives, "ti" > di > zhe > zeus, "Lives
zeus".
"S-lo vene-ti" > "S-lo" > Zh(ive)-li > "Lives
li", "vene-ti" > zhivee-zhe > "Lives zeus". Hence, "Lives
li, Lives zeus".
"Ph-ry-gi"/"B-ry-gi", "Th-ra-ci" > Ve' ra gi > Lives
ra and zeus.
"Pe la-s gi" > Ve' la-s gi > Lives li-the life giving and zeus.
Thus, the indigenous Pelasgians were religious "Gio-r-gi", "Sloveni" or "E-lle
ni", not later hybrid (proto-Slav/Hebrew,etc?!) "Graikos" or "Ellines".
ETOCRETAN AND PHOENICIAN
"The early Minoan language, known as Etocretan,
used the Linear A script (first used from around 1650 BC), and both
this language and its script have never been deciphered. Professor
Cyrus Gordon has argued that Etocretan was a Semitic language related to
Phoenician, but this has never been proven -although it has to be said
that such a heritage would make a great deal of sense."
The above quote comes from the article "Linear A (Scota and Gaedel -part
8)", Digest #34.
Reply:
Etocretan was a proto-Slavic language and Linear A was a proto-Slavic script.
Crete > "Kriti" > K>G > "G(io)-ra (i) di" > the
life giving Sun god ra and zeus.
Crete was also known as "Aeria" > E-ri > "(zhiv)E-ra" > the
life giving Sun god ra.
The Therans (pre Volcanic eruption of 1625 BC) were also proto-Slavs.
The-ra > Ve' ra > Lives ra.
The Phoenicians, however, are said to have appeared on the scene as a maritime
nation centuries later from around the 11th century BC.
Phoenician > "Vene zhe" > Zhivee zhe > Lives zeus. Ph>F>P>B>V > "Pene
zhe" > "Bene di" > "Vene ti" > "Slo
vene".
"S-lo vene" > Zhive-li zhivee > the life giving Sun god li, lives.
It appears that the early Veneti were proto-Slavs, whilst the later Phoenicians
could well have been a mix of proto-Slavs and Hebrews!
In Homer's Iliad (originally written in the 8th century BC), the "Pelasgians",
interestingly, are identified as Trojans and the inhabitants of Crete.
T-ro-ja > Ve' ra zhe > Lives ra and zeus.
By Vasko
Mycenaeans & Linear
B (Scota and Gaedel -part 10)
"At some later date, it is thought that the
Mycenaeans adopted the (Minoan) Linear A alphabet and adapted it for
their own language, and this became the Linear B script and language".
(1)
".....a more tenable scenario is that the royalty of the Mycenaeans were
not of the same culture or nationality as the common people. Indeed, they may
have been of exiled Hyksos-Egyptian stock, and had taken over the Mycenaean people
by force and become their de facto leaders". (2)
"Likewise, if the Mycenaeans had been influenced to this degree by
the exiled Hyksos-Israeltes (c. 1580 BC) then this would have been a logical
destination for the exodus of Aye-Dannus some three centuries later (c. 1330
BC)". (3)
"Both the new script (Linear B) and the new language subsequently
supplanted the original Minoan script and language back in Knossos, Crete (from
around 1400 BC)". (4)
"The general thrust of this chronology and argument is that there
may well have been Egyptian influences upon the Minoan and Mycenaean languages,
which were provided by the many exiles fleeing from Egypt; including Aye-Dannus".
(5)
"At a much later date (around the 9th century BC), the "Greeks" then
adopted the simpler Phoenician script but maintained the same language.....".
(6)
SOME MORE ON LINEAR B:
".....-Linear A was superseded by the more sophisticated Linear B script".
(7)
".....some of the alphabetic characters (of the Linear A script) are similar
to the later Linear B characters.....". (8)
"The exact language represented by the Linear B script was unknown
for a long time, but then a nonspecialist in the field of etymology, Michael
Ventris, demonstrated that the Linear B was a syllabic alphabet and that the
tablets that had been discovered were written in an archaic form of 'Greek'
At first this discovery did not go down too well with the establishment,
especially those from Greece who were effectively being told by a non-academic
Englishman that the artifacts in their museums were actually written in
their own language. However, despite all the protests, it became abundantly clear
that Ventris was correct, and that the Linear B tablets in both Mycenae in Greece and
Knosssos in Crete were all written in an early early form of Greek.
Fired on by this discovery, many have subsequently tried to show that the
earlier Linear A script tablets were also written in Greek, but that attempt
has so far failed, and the Linear A texts remain undeciphered." (9)
".....this is not to say that the language of the Greeks is going
to prove to be a complete derivation of the Egyptian language, as Hebrew appears
to be". (10)
Scota: Egyptian Queen of The Scots, by Ralph Ellis, Adventures
Unlimited, USA, 2006, Pages 93-96.
By A Digest Reader
Words
RE:
The Chosen People -part 2
Abraham's first son was "Ishmael" by Hagar.
I-sh-ma-el > "I-sh" means Zhe-zh(ivee)/Zeus-lives. "I-s" > "I-s(u)(s)",
as in "J(e)-s(u)(s)"/Zhe-zhivee/Zeus-lives.
"ma" > mother of zeus, "el" > the Sun god.
Abraham's second son was Isaac by his wife Sarah. Isaac's son was Jacob.
Jacob became known as "Israel" after his wrestle with God, which
was a test by God on him. "Jacob called the place where this happened 'Penuel',
saying 'For I have seen God face to face'."
Reply: Ja-co > Zhivee-ko(s)/Lives zeus. "I-s ra-el" > "I-s"/Zhe-zhivee/Zeus-lives, "ra-el"/the
Sun god.
The "el" in Penuel refers to the Sun god. "Penu" = "Venu",
which could mean "to see".
In Macedonian and other Slavic languages the word "to see" is vid/vide/vidu.
Hence, "Vidu-el".
However, in my opinion, "Penu-el" probably means Venu-el, "Zhive-li" > Lives
li.
Venu-el = Veni-amin > Lives-god.
By Vasko
The
Meaning of "Makedonija"
It's obvious that "Makedonija" is a pre-Christian,
proto-Slavic term which means "Mother of Zeus State". Make/Mother,
don/zeus, ija/state.
Expecting to find a similar meaning, I checked out www.macedoniaontheweb.com to see what the impostors had to
say.
The following is what I found!
"The name Makedon comes from 'Makednos', which is derived from the
word 'Makos' meaning length. The Macedonians were regarded as tall people, and
they are likely to have received their name on account of their height".
REPLY: That is absurd!!! HAHAHAHAHAHA!!! Risto, Please!
This is nothing more than a desperate attempt by them to hide the
true meaning of the term!
This is because "Make" for them doesn't mean "Mother"!
Furthermore, "Make" was not a 'Eur-African' City State word. If
it was it did not mean "mother".
"Mater" (not 'Make') meant mother in later Eur-African City State
koine. If Macedonians were Eur-Africans they would have called themselves "Materdanians" instead.
"Mitera" (not 'Mater' nor 'Make') means mother in modern ArvanitoVlach
bastardized imposed koine.
Therefore, one would expect a term from them something like "Miteradanians".
By Atanas
Book and other Reviews
A Macedonian History of Macedonia
By Victor Bivell
Thank you to Dushan Ristevski and the Macedonian Literary Association Grigor Prlichev for inviting me to launch this much-needed book, Short History of Macedonia, by well-known Macedonian Canadian author, Risto Stefov.
The book is 300 pages long but it seemed shorter than that as I enjoyed reading it. It's a very good narrative; it tells an interesting story; it held my attention; it was easy to read; and it's quite fast paced, almost racy in places. Overall it was very enjoyable.
The book is a good introduction to Macedonian history. The story is very accessible, and no prior knowledge is needed to understand it and enjoy it. So it would make a good introduction for young English speaking Macedonians, and for general English readers with little prior knowledge about Macedonia.
But the book also has a lot to offer more knowledgeable readers. Because the book is a "short history", many people, Macedonians in particular, may feel they know enough about Macedonia's history to skip this "short" version, but that would be a mistake.
For my own part, even when the book is talking about parts of history that I've already read quite a lot about, such as Alexander the Great or the Greek Civil War, I didn't feel any sense of repetition. Rather, I still wanted to keep reading because the story is told in an interesting way and with many facts and historical snippets that I didn't know. So the book has got a lot to offer those people, including Macedonians, who already have some knowledge or even a lot of knowledge about Macedonian history.
The book is useful for both knowledgeable and unknowledgeable readers because it does something that most books don't do - it gives a 2,800 year overview of the major events in Macedonia's history. Particularly its political history. It starts at around 800 BC and ends in 2007. In this massive time line, the author does a good job of picking the key events in Macedonia's political history and telling them in a logical, informative and interesting way.
A little over a third of the book is about the early Macedonians from Kings Philip and Alexander to the end of the Macedonian Empires. A little under a third is about the Roman occupation through to the end of the Ottoman occupation. And a little over a third is about the struggle for freedom in the modern period including the Greek, Bulgarian and Serbian occupations and the development of the Republic of Macedonia.
Although the book is a short history, the section on Philip and Alexander is crammed with action and facts and is quite detailed in places, enough to give me the impression the author is particularly keen on this part of Macedonian history and has spent a lot of time researching it. Even though I've read about Philip and Alexander before, I still found out many things I didn't know and found this section very interesting.
If I can quote one example of both the strong narrative and the plethora of facts:
"The news of Philip's murder attracted the attention of the whole world; especially the City States who rejoiced in knowing that he was gone. Alexander was quick to let them know that he expected from them the same loyalty that they had for his father. He reminded the City States that the Treaty of the League of Corinth was perpetual and gave him a legal claim to be Hegemon, the same as his father. But Alexander's words did not please the City States in the least, for in Athens they were dancing n the streets with joy. Demosthenes, intoxicated with the prospect of liberty, appeared in council dressed in white with a wreath on his head making offerings to the gods for the joyful news. The call to freedom from Athens spread like wildfire to the rest of the City States. The Aetolians recalled all those exiled by Philip, the Ambraciots expelled the Macedonian garrison, the Thebans took up arms to liberate Cadmeia and there were signs of rebellions in Peloponnesus, Argos, Elis and Arcadia."
As you can see - a fast, information-packed, action-packed and colorful narrative.
I particularly liked the section after the death of Alexander and the breakup of his empire, as it is a part of Macedonian history that for a long time I have wanted to read more about but I haven't yet had the chance. This section gave me a good overview of the main political characters and events, and the intense political intrigues and maneuverings of the era. With a better understanding of the times, I now feel I can come back to this period with more confidence and fill in the details.
In the middle section, the book gives an essential outline of the main historical events: the conquest and occupation by Rome, the coming of Christianity, Byzantine Macedonia, Sts Kiril and Metodi, Sts Kliment and Naum, Tsar Samoil, the Ottoman occupation, Marko Krale, the Karposh Uprising, the breakup of the Ottoman Empire and the political instability of the 19th century.
Although this section covers a long time span and covers most topics briefly, it is full of interesting facts and colorful snippets about the characters and events.
For example: "It was during the reign of Byzantine emperor Michael III (842- 867) that Solun had definitely established itself as the religious and philosophical centre of the empire. This was the time when Kiril (Cyril) and Metodi (Methodius) set off on a series of missions to spread the doctrines of Christianity to various places in Eastern Europe and Asia.
"I just want to mention here that, by the eighth century AD, the Macedonian eparchy was controlled by a Macedonian Archbishopric with its centre located in Solun and bishoprics existed in eighteen towns including Lerin, Kostur, Voden and Serres."
Another example centuries later about the failed Karposh Uprising under the Ottomans:
"Karposh was brought before Selim Giray who at the time was standing on the Stone Bridge over the River Vardar. Selim used him for target practice and impaled him with his Tartar lances. He then had his body hurled into the Vardar River. Karposh died early in December of 1689 and with him the Karposh uprising.
For the rebels who survived the battles there was no salvation from the Ottoman backlash except to leave Macedonia. Many fled north beyond the Sava and Danube Rivers. Some even went as far north as Russia and joined the Russian military. There they formed the "Macedonian regiment" which became part of the regular Russian army. The failed Karposh uprising depleted the local population of northwestern Macedonia, opening the way for large scale Albanian immigration.
"Just as the Karposh revolt was winding down in Macedonia, on April 6, 1690, Leopold I issued a manifesto inviting "all peoples of Albania, Serbia, Mysia, Bulgaria, Silistria, Illyria, Macedonia and Rashka to join the Austrians in taking up arms against the Ottomans". Then on April 26, 1690 he issued a letter making Macedonia and her people his protectorate. It has been said that Leopold acted on the advice of Macedonians Marko Krajda of Kozhani and Dimitri Georgija Popovich of Solun. Among other things the letter stated that "we graciously accept the Macedonian people, in its entirety in every respect, under our imperial and regal protection". Another letter was issued on May 31, 1690 extending Austria's protection to Bulgaria, Serbia and Albania. Unfortunately, all these good gestures were too little too late for Macedonia which by 1690 was back under tight Ottoman control."
There are plenty other of these sort of easy-to-read and informative snapshots of history. Many, like the last two, also re-affirm the historical existence of the Macedonian people.
When we get to the start of the Ilinden Uprising and the Macedonian struggle for freedom, the book and the narrative contain so much information that again I get the feeling that, like many Macedonians, myself included, this is a period of Macedonian history in which the author is particularly interested. This also comes out in his biographical treatment of some of the key Macedonian revolutionaries - Damian Gruev, Gotse Delchev, Krste Misirkov, Nikola Karev, Yane Sandanski, and Dimo Hadzhi-Dimov.
This detailed interest continues with the discussion of the division of Macedonia in the First and Second Balkan Wars, the impact of the First and Second World Wars, the founding of the Republic of Macedonia, and the Greek Civil War. There is also a very good account of Macedonian leader and freedom fighter Mirka Ginova, and the evacuation of the child refugees from Greece.
The book ends with the independence of the Republic of Macedonia from Yugoslavia and the continuing struggle for recognition and human rights in Greece and Bulgaria and to a lesser extent Albania.
Overall, as a short history of a land with a very long history, the author has picked the right points of history to discuss. All the main events, characters and themes are here.
Another good feature of the narrative is that the author sticks to information and facts. The little commentary that accompanies it is usually short, relevant and credible.
This contrasts with histories of Macedonia written by some non-Macedonians, such as the Greeks and many Oxford-Cambridge University academics. The book is free of the history-by-assertions, history-by-cliches, and history-by-slogans that the Greeks are so good at. Examples are "Philip united the Greeks" and "Alexander spread Hellenism". There is none of that debatable propaganda here.
A final example. While the modern Greeks are committing cultural genocide against the modern Macedonians by asserting "There were no Macedonians in Macedonia" and "There is no Macedonian minority in Greece", their British academic accomplices are committing cultural genocide against the ancient Macedonians by writing them out of history. Instead of using terms like "Macedonian Empire" or "Macedonian Period", they use "Hellenistic Period" even though the term "Hellenistic" was coined less than 200 years ago, that is, nearly 2,000 years after the end of the Macedonian Empire.
If you said to Alexander the Great that he left behind not a "Macedonian Empire", not a "Macedonian Period", not an "Alexandrian Empire", not even a "Post-Alexandrian Period", but a "Hellenistic Period" he would not know what you were talking about. Given that Alexander founded a large number of cities and named almost all of them after himself and none after anything in Greece or anything Greek, it is unlikely that he would have named his legacy to mankind after anything but himself. He would certainly not have named it a "Hellenistic Period", that is, a "Greekish Period".
There is none of that politically motivated cultural genocide here. This is not a Greek history of Macedonia, not a Bulgarian history of Macedonia, not a British ivory tower history of Macedonia. It is a Macedonian history of Macedonia. This book is a strong affirmation of the unique history and identity of Europe's first nation state and its much-loved land.
Short History of Macedonia can be purchased from the Macedonian Literary Association Grigor Prlichev by contacting Dushan Ristevski on dristevski@optusnet.com.au and phone 0425 231 335.
Published in Australian Macedonian Weekly 30 September 2008
Zdravo, Risto!
Ti isprakjam eden link od www.tema1.net od FotoTema "Makedonija uspeshna
prikazna": http://www.tema1.net/fototema-Makedonija-uspesna-prikazna.htm .
Ako si vo moznost, preprati go linkot do tvoite prijateli i poznati za da mozat
da ja vidat slikata od ovaa prikazna.
So pocit, pozdrav od Makedonija,
Mire Arsenievski / www.tema1.net / mire@tema1.net /
Poetry
Прогонет јазик
Заседи му поставуваа
На јазикот мајчин
Во утра и самраци
Зад грмушки и зад авлии
Под дрвја бујнозелени
И прозорци натажени
Ѕун на погромно ехо
Ведрини затемнуваше
И песните приспивни
И песните свадбени
Ги заглушуваше
Со тетор чудовишен
Над живиот збор
Беспредел горчина зацари
Во крајот егејски тогаш
Кога ритери мрачни
Со закон го забранија
Јазикот мајчин
Posted by Tomce
From the Archives
Feedback
Risto, in the Macedonian Digest Edition 34 - October 2008 in the article “Just how 'Greek' was the Byzantine Empire?” you have included Turkey as the birth places of Emperors. I wasn't aware that Turkey existed in the first millennium... (Edi)
You are right Edi, Turkey did not exist in the first millennium. The article should have said “where modern Turkey is today” instead of just “Turkey”. Sorry about that!
Whoever said that the Byzantine Empire was Greek?
First, the Byzantines called themselves “Romans” and the official language was Latin in the early period (e.g. during the reign of Constantine, Justin, etc). Greek was the language of the Church. To this day, Constantinopolean Greeks call their language “Romeka,” not “Ellinika” and others call them “Rum” (Roman). Istanbul Armenians call the Istanbul Greeks “Horom” (Roman) and the Greeks of Greece “Houyn.” The last emperor of Byzantium died as a “Roman.” The Greeks of today clearly distinguish between “Hellenes” and the “other Greeks” whose “Greekness” is cultural rather than ethnic.
In addition, “Roman” was never a term used to refer to ethnicity (which is not even a concept that existed at the time). Starting at about the time of Hadrian and Trajan it did not even refer to people coming from the Italian peninsula. The Antonines defined “Romanness” as a way of life and everyone who chose that way of life was considered “Roman.” This pretty much built upon the tradition of Alexander the Great who also defined “Greekness” as a way of life. Indeed, our early Armenian kings (e.g. Tigranes), together with other kings of post-Alexander states around them, were “Greek” in this sense of the word.
This is why it’s a little misleading to call the Byzantine Emperors “non-Greek.” The “ethnicities” attributed to them in the list are not really “ethnicities.” They’re simply the geographical locations of their birthplaces. Nobody was “Greek” in the sense that we perceive that word today, but, conversely, nobody was “Armenian” or “Kurdish” in the sense that those words are understood today.
Best regards, Ara
NEOLITHIC MACEDONIANS?
"From the evidence discovered, Neolithic Macedonians (if one can call
them Macedonians!), may have been the inventors of the "phonetic language".
The extract above comes from the article "The Proto-Slavs, Ancient
Egyptians & Hebrews Were Descendants of Sub-Saharan African Peoples".
(in last months issue)
Reply: There is a difference between "Makedonna" and "Makedonija"!
These particular people would have been Make-donna (Mother of Zeus) believers,
not Macedonians!
The expanding ancient state of Makedonija began from 825 BC. Although Makedonna
believers, they now became "Macedonians". Citizens of Mother of Zeus
State!
By Atanas
E-mail(s) of the Month
History lessons for public toilets
From: MEGAS ALEXANDROS (monkeydonia@gmail.com)
Sent: October 5, 2008 1:51:35 PM
To: rstefov@hotmail.com
Who are you to write articles about Greece and the Hellenes?
You are a declared enemy of the Greeks so take this as a friends warning
and stop writing anti Greek articles.
Greeks do not write about your morally twisted and identity confused people,
to witch people like yourself, are responsible for corrupting and confusing!
How much do they pay you and who gives you the green light to write such
perverse, divisive things??
You have become the lowest common denominator of decency and a fine example
of what a 'bad' human being is.
I wish you no harm, but I hope you re educate yourself, from proper historians,
rather than the history fools that have come onto your path and ruined your
reasoning.
Soon you will have no place to write, besides your toilet paper.
A friend.
Quotable Quotes
“Not only did ‘Greeks’ not liberate themselves, someone else actually invented them.” (Maknews)
“I find it laughable that my blood relatives who are Grkomani are totally accepted as Hellenes, while I am a Slav Skopian interloper. What a joke.” (Osiris)
“Today's Modern Greeks have zero claim to any ancient Greek history or culture. Modern Greeks are ethnic and cultural shape shifters.” (Maknews)
Question/Answers for the Readers
From the Un-answered Questions File
The following are extracts that touch upon as to why experts
are divided in their theories, Also, the extracts touch upon language evolution.
Mario Alinei
Darwinism, traditional linguistics and the new Palaeolithic Continuity Theory
of Language Evolution published in Gontier, Nathalie; Bendegem, Jean
Paul van; Aerts, Diederik (Eds.),
Evolutionary Epistemology, Language and Culture. A non-adaptationist, systems
theoretical approach, Springer, Berlin, Heidelberg, New York, pp. 121-147.
December 6th 2006
Extract of Summary
As the author has shown in previous work, although linguistics as a science
was born in Darwin’s century, Darwinism’s influence on it was superficial and
produced the mystifying, but still current, view that language is a living organism,
and language change an organic law. Language is, instead, a social artifact with
an interface with nature, which is governed by the law of conservation and changes
only exceptionally. Since language is innate - as claimed by Chomsky and now
demonstrated by natural sciences - and Homo was thus born loquens, the evolution
of language - and all world languages, including Indo-European (IE) - must be
mapped onto the entire course of human cultural evolution, in the new framework
provided by the Palaeolithic Continuity Theory (PCT).
The cultural context of the 19th century
First of all, it is necessary to remember that the 19th century was not
dominated, culturally, by the emergence of evolutionary theory, but, on the contrary,
by a very conservative, theological view of nature, according to which the Bible
was the basic source for knowledge, and thus also for science.
As is known (e.g. Daniel 1962, Pinna 1992), Pre-Darwinian scholarship saw
the duration of the earth and of life, as well as the beginning of human history,
as set down by the Bible. And the text of the Bible, in its authorized version
published in England in 1701, included the results of Dr. John Lightfoot’s and
bishop James Ussher’s earlier calculations, according to the latter of which
the universe was created by God on Sunday the 23rd of October 4004 b.c, beginning
at sunset of the 22nd, Adam and Eve were driven out of Eden in the same year,
on November 10, and Noah’s ark saved living beings from the Flood on May 5, 1491
b.c. Throughout the 19th century, and as late as the Victorian era - that is
long after Darwin published his book - this was the current view about the origins
of the universe. For the same reason, contemporary scholars reduced the entire
human prehistory to the so-called Four Monarchies - Persian, Assyrian, Greek
and Roman. And in the almost 6000 years between the present and the divine Creation
in 4004 B.C., nothing short of a catastrophic, supernatural event could explain
the process of geological accumulation and change. The biblical Flood provided
an exceptionally effective example of such a catastrophe. In short, before the
four monarchies there was only impenetrable fog, and before the year 4000 b.c.
was the supernatural.
And it was precisely the strength of this belief that caused, in the 19th
century, a sharp division between contemporary scholars: on the one hand the
majority, called Catastrophists, who interpreted the terrestrial documentation
in conformity with the Book of Genesis, saw the Flood as an example of supernatural
catastrophes, and the biological past of the earth as a succession of supernatural
catastrophes, each followed by new acts of supernatural creation. And on the
other a minority of scholars, called Uniformitarianists, who studied the earth
and life in terms of natural phenomena and natural laws operating in the present,
and affirmed the natural character of the evolution, and the uninterrupted continuity
of species from their origins to the present, in spite of their transformations.
In the last three decades, archaeological research has made quite a few
revolutionary
advances, among which the most well-known is the much higher chronologies
of European prehistory, obtained by radiocarbon and other innovative dating
techniques. As far as Europe is concerned, the conclusion that interests
us the most are:
(a) There is absolutely no trace of a gigantic warlike invasion, such as
to have caused a
linguistic substitution on continental scale, as envisaged by the traditional
IE (Indo-European) theory.
(b) All Neolithic cultures of Europe are either a direct continuation of
Mesolithic ones, or
have been created by Mesolithic groups after their Neolithization by intrusive
farmers from the Middle East.
(c) There is every possible evidence for demic and cultural continuity,
from Upper
Paleolithic to the Metal Ages. Continuity is now universally considered the
basic pattern of European prehistory. Even James Mallory, probably the last
archaeologist who defends the IE invasion theory, has had to concede: "the
archaeologists' easiest pursuit [is] the demonstration of relative continuity
and absence of intrusion" (Mallory 1989: 81). All of this, again, represents
a firm basis for the Short PCT.
In fact, for the specific problem of the origins of IE (Indo-European) languages
Cavalli Sforza has first attempted to adjust his data to the traditional model
of the warlike invasion theory, claiming that the two data converged, and later
fully supported Renfrew’s model (Ammerman and Cavalli Sforza 1984), without realizing
– apparently – that also the latter model, with its catastrophic scenario for
both European and Asiatic people, clashes with his own claim of a close correspondence
between the a real distribution of genetic markers and that of world linguistic
phyla. Nevertheless, even Cavalli Sforza has recently had to surrender to the
latest outcome of genetic research, i.e. that 80% of the genetic stock of Europeans
goes back to Palaeolithic (e.g. Sykes 2001: 240 ff). As Bryan Sykes’ has recently
commented: “The Neolithic farmers ha[ve] certainly been important; but they ha[ve]
only contributed about one fifth of our genes. It [is] the hunters of the Palaeolithic
that ha[ve]created the main body of modern
European gene pool” (Sykes 2001: 242). This conclusion represents, in my
opinion, a firm basis for the Short PCT.
Short extract of conclusion
“…PCT can be regarded as successful, not only in its results but also in
its methods of seeking evidence in archaeology, (palaeo) anthropology, historical
sciences, and genetics and cognitive sciences…”
Paleolithic Continuity Theory - Marcel Otte, Alexander
Häusler, and Mario Alinei
These are excerpts from Mario Alinei’s Theory of Continuity are being quoted:
“I have to commence by clearing away one of the most absurd consequences
of the traditional chronology, namely, that of the ‘arrival’ of the Slavs into
the immense area in which they now live. The only logical conclusion can be that
the southern branch of the Slavs is the oldest and that from it developed the
Slavic western and eastern branches in a differing manner and perhaps at different
times.”
“Today only a minority of experts support the theory of a late migration
for the Slavs… because none of the variant versions of such late settlement answers
the question of what crucial factor could possibly have enabled the Slavs to
have left their Bronze-Age firesides to become the dominant peoples of Europe.
The southwestern portion of the Slavs had always bordered on the Italic people
in Dalmatia, as well as in the areas of the eastern Alps and in the Po lowlands.”
“The surmised ‘Slavic migration’ is full of inconsistencies. There is no
‘northern Slavic language’, it is rather only a variant of the southern Slavic…
The first metallurgic cultures in the Balkans are Slavic… and connected with
Anatolia… Slavic presence in the territory, nearly identical to the one occupied
by them today, exists ever since the Stone Age… The Slavs have (together with
the Greeks and other Balkan peoples developed agriculture… agriculturally mixed
economy, typically European, which later enabled the birth of the Greek, Etruscan,
and Latin urbanism. Germanic peoples adopted agriculture from the Slavs… The
Balkans is one of the rare regions in which a real and true settlement of human
groups coming from Anatolia is proven…]. This was a sobering analysis by Anthony
Ambrozic.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paleolithi
... ity_Theory
http://www.continuitas.com/
Posted by Seldom Balance
Humour
November 18, 2008
New York, UN News Dispatch
BREAKING NEWS - NOVI NOVINI
In a sudden unexpected about face Greece today put forward a new negotiating position towards its northerly neighbour Macedonia. In light of the recent UN investigation concerning ethnic populations in the Northern Provinces, in an unprecedented diplomatic move, Greece agreed to recognize Macedonia by its constitutional name THE REPUBLIC OF MACEDONIA. “It is a great statesmanlike act” said the President of the United Nations, “and will go a long way to create stability in the Balkans and in Europe. Greece must be congratulated for its big heartedness, and has exhibited a great spirit of compromise in these long standing negotiations.” “Whew! We’re all relieved” said a spokesman fanning the air. Similar statements have been issued by the State Department of the USA, Russia, China, Canada and most other UN Members. No comment has yet been issued by the EU who has chosen to study the matter further. .
Some conditions were attached to the proposal. As a pre-condition, Macedonia is required to revert to its originally chosen national flag. The National Flag was surrendered by Macedonia in early negotiations as an indication that it was willing to negotiate. To offset this accommodation with Macedonia, Greece in another surprise move, proposes to adopt its own new flag. An artist’s version of the new flag was leaked to the Press by a Senior Civil Servant and is attached hereto. Greece does so on the condition that she be given an exclusive copyright to the “Hellenic Cross” in the upper left hand corner. “It is a modern version adapted from the classic Greek Key design found on ancient temples in the heart of Athens,” said the designer whose identity has not been revealed. This symbol provides an historic link to other flags that have been flown in most of Eastern Europe from time to time and honours a kinship with others who hold the same political ideals of Greece and its former Monarchy and Military Dictatorship. The flag was first raised at a secret midnight ceremony lit by burning crosses at the foot of the Acropolis at which thousands attended.
(Insert the proposed new Greek Flag here)
A further condition is that all ‘so-called’ Macedonians in the Diaspora be required to sign an affidavit (a) that they are no longer Macedonians (b) that they left Greece on their own free will to seek fortunes in foreign lands (c) that they have abandoned all claims to property that they, or forefathers may have claimed to own in Greece, and (d) that they have no living relatives in Greece or relatives buried there.. These affidavits are to be made available free of charge at every Greek Embassy. In the event that the person cannot read or write Greek, a priest of the Greek Orthodox Church will be available to complete the document for them and perform a baptism at the same time. As there are approximately 8 million Macedonians in the Diaspora, the negotiations may have to be continued for some unforeseeable time into the future.
The breakthrough has been heralded by Greeks and ‘would be Greeks’ everywhere.
Submitted by Dedo Kire .
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